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<p>Redirect to Archive is great to keep pages which may have
historic value in context. In other cases a two step deletion is
also perfectly OK. Just ditching the whole Wiki rang my alarm
bells. <br>
</p>
<p>Not sure if using the board f2f gives OSGeo the best value of
your time though? You should be talking through contentious issues
(there always are). Outdated pages tend to get lost in history
eventually. But maybe you are really well organized and can focus
on the important pages. I wouldn't really know where to start, it
is pretty overwhelming. :-) Therefore a big Kudos to the board for
(trying to) tackle this! <br>
</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 28.05.19 um 17:01 schrieb Jody
Garnett:<br>
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<div dir="auto">That is lots of great experience, I think I used
redirect to the Archive page. Do you like this approach?</div>
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<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">For the board f2f meeting we are looking at
reviewing all the pages the board is responsible for and sorting
out what can be approved and what can be archived so the out
dated information (or great idea that did not happen) does not
confuse. </div>
<div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, May 28, 2019 at
16:08 Seven (Aka Arnulf) <<a
href="mailto:seven@arnulf.us" moz-do-not-send="true">seven@arnulf.us</a>>
wrote:<br>
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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
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Am 28.05.19 um 13:02 schrieb Tom Kralidis:<br>
><br>
> On Tue, 28 May 2019, Markus Neteler wrote:<br>
><br>
>> Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 11:24:01 +0200<br>
>> From: Markus Neteler <<a
href="mailto:neteler@osgeo.org" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">neteler@osgeo.org</a>><br>
>> To: "Seven of Nine (aka Arnulf)" <<a
href="mailto:seven@arnulf.us" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">seven@arnulf.us</a>><br>
>> Cc: Tom Kralidis <<a
href="mailto:tomkralidis@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">tomkralidis@gmail.com</a>>,<br>
>> osgeo-board List <<a
href="mailto:board@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">board@lists.osgeo.org</a>><br>
>> Subject: Re: [Board] wiki cleanup<br>
>><br>
>> Hi all,<br>
>><br>
>> On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 8:55 PM Seven of Nine (aka
Arnulf)<br>
>> <<a href="mailto:seven@arnulf.us"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">seven@arnulf.us</a>>
wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> Hi folks,<br>
>>> great idea to give the Wiki some love and way
overdue. But broken <br>
>>> URLs are a sign of careless web people. Lost
history is too. <br>
>>> MediWiki goes out of its ways not to break URLs
and keep histories <br>
>>> intact and they are actually doing a great job.
So I see no sense in <br>
>>> ditching all and copying "vital/current".
Nobody can tell what is <br>
>>> still alive or needed. Is old < vital (asks
an oldtimer... :-)<br>
>>><br>
>>> So /me is very much in favor of keeping all and
deleting and merging <br>
>>> bluntly. Those who really care or look for
something can follow the <br>
>>> bread crumb to the start of the Wiki. How cool
is that? Imagine a <br>
>>> history student in 2056 tracing back to a few
folks sitting in <br>
>>> Chicago and debating the need of free or open
in a name. Would be a <br>
>>> pity to loose that, wouldn't it?<br>
>><br>
>> My plea as a former board member: Please do not
trash our history.<br>
>><br>
>> Cleanup is fine and needed but keeping important
(historical) pages <br>
>> alive.<br>
>><br>
>> Best<br>
>> Markus<br>
><br>
> Thanks for the valuable feedback. Would cleaning up the
wiki in effect be<br>
> losing history as well? Nonetheless, fully agree not
to lose history.<br>
><br>
> ..Tom<br>
<br>
<br>
Tom, Board,<br>
<br>
regular users cannot delete pages. This is a feature
restricted to <br>
Sysops by MediaWiki (see current list of OSGeo Sysops: <br>
<a
href="https://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers&group=sysop"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers&group=sysop</a>).
<br>
Even when sysops delete pages they can still be recreated by
any other <br>
sysop from the internal archive. This is to avoid that
somebody <br>
permanently changes the history of the Wiki without being
able to <br>
recover it. Removing content completely from MediaWiki is
possible but <br>
requires server access and scripts or extended SQL hacks. An
extreme <br>
situation that could be imagined would be that the CoC
decides that <br>
something has to be completely eradicated from the database
in which <br>
case they should probably file a ticket for SAC.<br>
<br>
When sysops delete pages it does effectively change the
history for <br>
normal users. Therefore deletions should be done
considerately and only <br>
by trusted community members (e.g. the sysops of this Wiki).
Hundreds of <br>
Spam pages have for example already been deleted like that.<br>
<br>
Still, deleting old, outdated and especially wrong pages may
be <br>
required. Even then in many cases it will serve better to
merge the <br>
content with another page or to add a redirect than to
simply delete <br>
because deletions break the Web. It is very easy to "move" a
MediaWiki <br>
page by adding the functional link like [[redirect:New
Name]] to the <br>
corresponding content page where "New Name" is the content
URL. Many <br>
users have added redirects from their full names to their
default user <br>
pages, like here: <br>
<a
href="https://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php?title=Anita_Graser&redirect=no"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php?title=Anita_Graser&redirect=no</a><br>
<br>
<br>
My suggestion is to create a new tag, for example
[[Category: <br>
Deletion]]. Any regular user can add this tag to any page.
Sysops would <br>
then periodically go through this Category, double check the
deletion <br>
suggestions and if they appear sensible delete the outdated
or dead <br>
content or - better even - add a more appropriate redirect
to the page. <br>
I pledge to do this for two hours per week for the next
three months <br>
(and then we can revisit the item and see how we proceeded).<br>
<br>
Rationale: When we moved to the new web site (which was a
good thing) we <br>
unfortunately also lost quite a lot of links (which is bad).
Especially <br>
a lot of links from the Wiki to the old web site now end up
in a 404 <br>
which is simply not good.<br>
<br>
Keeping the Wiki and only moving things around, adding
redirects and <br>
only deleting in "very-dead-content" cases would be my
favorite way <br>
forward.<br>
<br>
If there are other concerns regarding the current Wiki which
I may <br>
completely miss, please enlighten us.<br>
<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
<br>
Seven<br>
<br>
<br>
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-- <br>
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<div>--</div>
<div>Jody Garnett</div>
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