[Carto] Students: Get Paid to work on thisproject(isthisstillthe thread about high resolution printing??)

Mon Apr 12 19:49:01 EDT 2010

Bob,

I just started looking into this myself the last few weeks. I'm really interested in learning how to use SketchUp to produce 3D models from our survey and engineering data. I did check out a 3D PDF generator plug-in for SketchUp. It worked, but it was a little crude. I almost think the viewer for Sketch-Up made by Google might be a better way to go.

I'm going to work on an OBJ importer for SketchUp. Then I hope to write some AutoLISP code that will export simple drawing entities in OBJ format. I'll keep you posted as things develop.

I'm still interested in open source alternatives for a 3D model viewer. Maybe World Wind might do the trick. I need to look into this more.

Landon
Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268
Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658

________________________________________
From: Bob Basques [mailto:Bob.Basques at ci.stpaul.mn.us] 
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 12:43 PM
To: Dane Springmeyer; Landon Blake; Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo)
Cc: carto at lists.osgeo.org
Subject: RE: [Carto] Students: Get Paid to work on thisproject(isthisstillthe thread about high resolution printing??)

Landon, 

Didn't think it pertinent here, but I'm the CAD Manager at the City (85+ seats) for AutoDesk Products,  Lot and lots (and lots) of experience there.  Bit AutoLISP guy, lot's and lot's of Web service integration for our can users with respect to importing of data, raster and vector. 

Question, you got any experience with 3D-PDF generation, this is my new obsession recently. 

bobb 

>>> "Landon Blake" <lblake at ksninc.com> wrote:
I suppose I should throw my capabilities out on the list as well. This may help us start to form teams as things get cooking.

I'm pretty good with Java, OK with Python and Ruby, could learn C, and I am scared to death of C++. I can code CSS and XHTML.
I would like to learn Perl and Javascript. I've got some pretty extensive experience writing parsers. I work regularly with Inkscape and AutoCAD. I'm pretty familiar with those file formats. I've also know how to use some common Java libraries for working with DXF, SHP, and PDF.

I'm certainly interested in cooking up at least part of the rendering engine as a desktop application in Java. I could use another language, but I've got a chunk of code in Java already.

Landon
Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268
Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658

________________________________________
From: Bob Basques [mailto:Bob.Basques at ci.stpaul.mn.us]
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 11:58 AM
To: Dane Springmeyer; Landon Blake; Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo)
Cc: carto at lists.osgeo.org
Subject: RE: [Carto] Students: Get Paid to work on this project(isthisstill the thread about high resolution printing??)

Landon (an others),

I suppose I should throw out my personal preferences and  competencies here . . .

I really like the idea of the print-canvas approach whether Web based (my preference initially) or desktop based.  Keep in mind that even the web based approach will require an "element" handler of some sort, which for the most part would likely end up inside of a desktop app.  My preference towards the Web route is mostly based on the notion that chunks of the process need to be separated out based on their respective functions, which makes things easier to hand off to the next guy, and to build components that are standalone(ish) in nature.

I'm pretty good with PERL on the server side, along with lots or time spent in Databases of all sorts.  I'm basic on the web side, other than knowing where to look for the answers when I need them.  I'm no expert in JS for example, but have written my fair share, I'm better at finding and integrating the experts to make the whole work.  I'm also interested in other forms of client side interfaces like Flash for example.

bobb

>>> "Landon Blake" <lblake at ksninc.com> wrote:
Bob,

I'm not a web developer by any stretch of the term, so I didn't get everything in your message. I did however like the concept of a canvas where the user can assemble common layout elements. This sounds like a way to make map layout a no brainer. Whether this component of the map-making project was on the web or in a desktop app, I like it!

I sort of think your white board or canvas component could almost be the visual editor for the input file that would specify the conversion parameters needed by the rendering engine.

It sounds like one of our challenges will be finding common ground among our diverse group. We will have some web guys, some desktop guys, some Java guys, some Python guys...

It sounds like we could at least get started on a spec. I wonder if we could create two "modules" in our project. One for a web app, and one for a desktop app. As we worked on the apps we could start talking about what each app would need the spec to look like. That would ensure a well-rounded spec.

This is just a suggestion, of course.

Landon
Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268
Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658

________________________________________
From: Bob Basques [mailto:Bob.Basques at ci.stpaul.mn.us]
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 11:42 AM
To: Dane Springmeyer; Landon Blake; Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo)
Cc: carto at lists.osgeo.org
Subject: RE: [Carto] Students: Get Paid to work on this project (isthisstill the thread about high resolution printing??)

All,

Well, basically, I've always thought along the lines of a Web app (engine) for the processing.  I'm a bit biased in this regard, but it shouldn't preclude building out a standalone version of some sort of engine either.

Anyway on to the ideas.

My thought was to use a print canvas sort of approach, where an online interface was used to assemble a print layout (could this be the specification side of the conversation so far) and send that to the engine for printing.  The reason I think  this user interface is important is more for the sales side of things, but I'm a big proponent of usability, and push/drag system on a web based whiteborad sort of interface seems like the right way to go.

Using a URL based (raster images would be a good start) approach to collecting print elements seems like a no brainer, where a separate web based engine could handle URL collection duties for display in the Print canvas, and the user has all the tools needed in the interface to push, drag, scale, etc, and in a visual form.  Using the Print Canvas approarch will allow for a very strict method of pushing the elements to the rendering engine as well.  It will act as a sort of pre-rendering filter of sorts.

It may sound like I'm trying to jump to the end before doing the middle, but I've been thinking about this a for a few years and even did some early concept work once upon a time.

The bigger benefit I see to this approach (and still keeping inside of the ideas discussed) is that things can be implemented in phases, raster first, vector (3D??), and the input and rendering are completely separated with regard to development streams.  If a project want to use the print canvas engine to render directly, they can, or let the users interact with the layout instead, either will work just fine.

I don't believe that this things need to get hung up on the specification side too much either, most elements would/could be collected via a URL resource for example, and already be in some sort of standard form.   The new stuff for layout, can be integrated into this new print canvas / render engine and stay project specific, right?

So, am I rambling, or does any of this make sense?

bobb

>>> "Landon Blake" <lblake at ksninc.com> wrote:
I shared my ideas Bob. Let's hear about your approach.

Landon
Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268
Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658

________________________________________
From: carto-bounces at lists.osgeo.org [mailto:carto-bounces at lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Bob Basques
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 11:24 AM
To: Dane Springmeyer; Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo)
Cc: carto at lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [Carto] Students: Get Paid to work on this project (isthis still the thread about high resolution printing??)

All,

Is this still the thread about high resolution printing?

If so, I have a different approach that might be worth offering. . . .

bobb

>>> "Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo)" <tmitchell at osgeo.org> wrote:
Dane Springmeyer wrote:
> Because there is not a third student focusing on the OSGEO side I think
> was is not being addressed is the interoperability/standards
> specification piece. Big picture this is likely better addressed outside
> of a code-based GSOC project and rather by the wider community.

I think you're hitting the nail on the head here.  With my "user of
several apps" hat on, I mainly care about the specifications side of
things.  Knowing that any "engine" app is already going to be focused on
improving quality, features, etc. the question from a larger, OSGeo
ecosystem perspective does really fall into the standards doesn't it?

What I would like to avoid is inventing a new spec, only to find that
another app already has a well thought out model in place.  I'd much
rather clone an existing model, API, whatever and then see what is
missing from our overall needs.  I'm most familiar with MapServer's
model, but was able to get a good glimpse into Mapnik when playing with
Quantumnik.  That kind of interoperability in a client app is quite
encouraging to see.

In the end, I'd like to take Application X and transform its config
files into the engine's model.  Thereby making this project also a bit
of a universal translator.. but I think I'm getting ahead of myself. :)

So, how do we get a good handle on potential specs to work from?  I
broke it down into three components:
* rendering stuff
* map layout details
* output formats/resolution etc.

Tyler
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