<div dir="ltr">Jeroen,<div>Definitely agree about wanting to host this some place neutral. So if not osgeo, how about <a href="https://github.com/opengeospatial">https://github.com/opengeospatial</a>? </div><div>It just worries me that folks will wonder why we need another new organization (metadata101). </div>
<div><br></div><div>-Rich</div><div>P.S. Incidentally, I'm not sure about in other countries, but here in the US the term "101" kind of implies "for beginners" and sometimes has a negative connotation.</div>
</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 6, 2014 at 12:31 AM, Steve Richard <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:steve.richard@azgs.az.gov" target="_blank">steve.richard@azgs.az.gov</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Jeroen—what you say makes sense. What would a registered profile look like in the metadata101 repository? To be useful, each profile should declare a URI that
identifies instances conforming to the profile. Is this part of your profile specification? Would there be any kind of curation of metadata101?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">steve<u></u><u></u></span></p><div class="">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Stephen M Richard<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Arizona Geological Survey<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">416 W. Congress #100<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Tucson, AZ<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">AZGS: 520-770-3500<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Office: 520-209-4127<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">FAX: 520-770-3505<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</div><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
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<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Jeroen Ticheler [mailto:<a href="mailto:jeroen.ticheler@geocat.net" target="_blank">jeroen.ticheler@geocat.net</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 05, 2014 10:50 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Steve Richard<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Rich Signell [via OSGeo.org]; <a href="mailto:cat-interop@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">cat-interop@lists.osgeo.org</a></span></p><div><div class="h5"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cat-interop] Metadata link types vocabulary proposal<u></u><u></u></div></div><p></p>
</div>
</div><div><div class="h5">
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Stephen and Richard,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks for the feedback. I agree that name recognition is a good thing. However, I feel that choosing for a domain/name that is not related to proprietary nor to open source software is a good thing. <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Within GeoNetwork opensource we've been developing metadata profile support in the form of plugins for several year now. Because these profiles are hosted on our GeoNetwork github, outsiders using other software for metadata management
are less likely to use and contribute to those profile plugins. This is a pity, because only a small part of the plugin is GeoNetwork specific while most is generic and often developed by a community of practice (e.g. a country or region, a community of marine
or soil experts). Hence we want to move the profiles outside of the GeoNetwork opensource projects so we attract a larger expert community.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">The idea is that under <a href="http://metadata101.org" target="_blank">metadata101.org</a> these profiles are developed and maintained by the profile custodians. Doing so has many benefits:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- Custodians manage versions better than software developers from a specific software.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- Interaction between metadata experts dealing with profiles can lead to more interoperable profiles.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- Transformations between profiles can be developed in a consistent manner between expert groups.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- Software developers of different applications that depend on supporting metadata profiles in their software need not to care about the specifics of a profile that much. They have a single point of reference for the schemas and the schematron
rules that come with such profile. <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- Software developers can ensure end users have the option to select the metadata profile of interest to them instead of hardcoding profiles into the software.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- End users and developers have an easier task in finding relevant & existing profiles. Now these are spread all over the place. And hardly anytime they can be found in a collaborative environment like github. So contributing or discussing
them is difficult right now.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">- It becomes easy for new communities to add their own metadata profile that can then automatically become available in their software of choice.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">There are for sure more reasons why it is useful to maintain metadata profiles in an independent location.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Since vocabularies are so closely related to the metadata profiles that often use them, it seems a fairly logical thing to me to maintain those in the same location. And as I said, not relating it to a specific software project or to an
open source (or proprietary) foundation makes it easier for both worlds to participate in the development, maintenance and use of these vocabularies.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I hope this makes sense to you. Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Jeroen<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">_____________________________________________</span><span style="font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">_______<br style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px">
<br>
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><b><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#130b51">Geo</span></b></span><span><b><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#00a7e3">Cat</span></b></span><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#fe2617"> </span></b><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#130b51">introduces</span></b><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#fe2617"> </span></b><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#00a7e3">Bridge</span></b><span><b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#00a7e3">© </span></b></span><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#130b51"><u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#130b51">An extension to ArcGIS</span></b><span><b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#130b51">©</span></b></span><b><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#130b51"> to
instantly publish data and metadata on GeoServer and GeoNetwork.</span></b><b><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">See <a href="http://geocat.net/" target="_blank">http://geocat.net</a> for more details. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">Jeroen Ticheler<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">GeoCat bv<br>
Veenderweg 13<br>
6721 WD Bennekom<br>
The Netherlands<br>
Tel: +31 (0)6 81286572<br>
</span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><a href="http://geocat.net" target="_blank">http://geocat.net</a></span><span style="font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><br>
<br>
<img border="0" width="95" height="20" src="cid:image001.png@01CF38C2.B1272FE0"></span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#2aa7df">Please consider the environment before printing
this email.</span><span style="font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 5 mrt. 2014, at 18:14, Steve Richard <<a href="mailto:steve.richard@azgs.az.gov" target="_blank">steve.richard@azgs.az.gov</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Good point. The name recognition is important. Jeroen, what can you tell us about metadata101—it looks pretty new.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Stephen M Richard</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Arizona Geological Survey</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">416 W. Congress #100</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Tucson, AZ</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">AZGS: 520-770-3500</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Office: 520-209-4127</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">FAX: 520-770-3505</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span></span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Rich
Signell [via<span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">OSGeo.org</span></a>] [<a href="mailto:ml-node+s1560n5107725h56@n6.nabble.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">mailto:ml-node+s1560n5107725h56@n6.nabble.com</span></a>]<span> </span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span> </span>Wednesday, March 05, 2014 10:13 AM<br>
<b>To:</b><span> </span>Steve Richard<br>
<b>Subject:</b><span> </span>Re: [cat-interop] Metadata link types vocabulary proposal</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I like the git idea, but would vote for osgeo github as a location, if<span> </span><br>
only because it has more name recognition at this point.<span> </span><br>
<br>
On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 8:54 AM, Jeroen Ticheler<span> </span><br>
<<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
> Hi Tom and others,<span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
> We are working on getting metadata profiles developed in a separate git repository<span> </span><a href="https://github.com/metadata101" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">https://github.com/metadata101</span></a> and published
under<a href="http://metadata101.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://metadata101.org</span></a> . This allows people to work on a range of metadata profiles while maintaining a common basis, so that applications can use these profiles from
a single source.<span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
> Would you be open to the idea to also host the vocabularies under that same umbrella? It would not be related to a specific project or foundation, which could help to get wide acceptance across open source and proprietary applications. This would be a great
benefit for interoperability in my opinion.<span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
> A build process could ensure the vocabularies are kept up to date under<span> </span><a href="http://metadata101.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://metadata101.org</span></a> while they are developed and versioned
on Github.<span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
> My 2 cents,<span> </span><br>
> Jeroen<span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
> On 5 mrt. 2014, at 14:12, Tom Kralidis <<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a>> wrote:<span> </span><br>
><span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> Thinking this though more, I think the way forward here is for this<span> </span><br>
>> to be an OSGeo vocabulary, which we can build and manage under<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab</span></a> like:<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/data/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/data/</span></a>{provider}/{type}[/version]<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/</span></a>{provider}/{type}[/version]<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> Then providing a thin resolution layer, members of this vocabulary, when<span> </span><br>
>> invoked via HTTP, would then dereference/resolve accordingly. Like:<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/ogc/sos/1.0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/ogc/sos/1.0</span></a><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> would resolve to:<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><a href="http://www.opengis.net/sos/1.0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://www.opengis.net/sos/1.0</span></a> (which then resolves as per the<span> </span><br>
>> authoritative provider's wishes).<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> This provides the following benefits:<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> 1./ metadata clients/servers can bind to the OSGeo vocabulary, thus<span> </span><br>
>> realizing the core goal of a harmonized link type list<span> </span><br>
>> 2./ anyone who really wants to invoke / resolve these can do so<span> </span><br>
>> 3./ This keeps OSGeo as a just a gatekeeper / custodian of the list with<span> </span><br>
>> redirects as appropriate, which gets us out of the complexity of<span> </span><br>
>> managing these across standards orgs/etc.<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> Comments? I've written a small Flask app to act as a high level<span> </span><br>
>> resolver, based on our link types list and will resolve / redirect<span> </span><br>
>> accordingly, which we can push forward for hosting, etc.<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>> On Mon, 3 Mar 2014, Tom Kralidis wrote:<span> </span><br>
>><span> </span><br>
>>> Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 21:53:51 -0500<span> </span><br>
>>> From: Tom Kralidis <<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a>><span> </span><br>
>>> To: Paul van Genuchten <<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a>><span> </span><br>
>>> Cc: "<<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a>>" <<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden
email]</span></a>><span> </span><br>
>>> Subject: Re: [cat-interop] Metadata link types vocabulary proposal<span> </span><br>
>>> On Mon, Mar 3, 2014 at 4:07 PM, Paul van Genuchten<span> </span><br>
>>> <<a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a>> wrote:<span> </span><br>
>>>> I support Stephan at this point. The semantic web can be a big consumer<span> </span><br>
>>>> of spatial data services, if we're able to optimally embed our data in<span> </span><br>
>>>> it. Linking to controlled vocabularies by url is a big facilitator.<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><br>
>>> Good points.<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><br>
>>>> Sure i see the point of having a urn structure as<span> </span><br>
>>>> {provider}:{type}:{identifier}:{version}. But this can also be managed<span> </span><br>
>>>> in a (skos) vocabulary-identifier-as-url by using identifiers like:<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>>> for example:<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/ogc/wms/1.1" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/ogc/wms/1.1</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/opensearch/opensearch/2.0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/opensearch/opensearch/2.0</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>>> and<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype/esri/shapefile/1.0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype/esri/shapefile/1.0</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype/ogc/gml/2.0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype/ogc/gml/2.0</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype/w3c/json-ld/1.0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype/w3c/json-ld/1.0</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>>> or<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/service#ogc_wms_1_1" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/service#ogc_wms_1_1</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype#ogc_gml_2_0" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/mediatype#ogc_gml_2_0</span></a><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>>> At this point we should consider if<span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">osgeo.org</span></a><span> </span>is the best place to set<span> </span><br>
>>>> up such a service/vocab, as this is more a data-matter then a software<span> </span><br>
>>>> matter. Should we connect with geovocab, w3c/ogc, dbpedia to have this<span> </span><br>
>>>> set up?<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><br>
>>> Based on the comments on HTTP URIs at<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><a href="https://github.com/OSGeo/Cat-Interop/issues/3" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">https://github.com/OSGeo/Cat-Interop/issues/3</span></a>, the OGC has this at<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><a href="http://www.opengis.net/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">www.opengis.net</span></a>. However the structure is not SKOS-like. I guess one<span> </span><br>
>>> factor is how deep version negotiation would go.<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><br>
>>> Then again, we could implement this in OSGeo and have resolver back to<span> </span><br>
>>> their authoritative resources (i.e.<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/csw/2.0.2" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://osgeo.org/vocab/service/csw/2.0.2</span></a> could resolve to<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><a href="http://www.opengis.net/cat/csw/2.0.2" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://www.opengis.net/cat/csw/2.0.2</span></a>. Does this sound useful/make<span> </span><br>
>>> sense?<span> </span><br>
>>><span> </span><br>
>>>> If we feel<span> </span><a href="http://osgeo.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">osgeo.org</span></a><span> </span>is a good place, let's post about it in the<span> </span><br>
>>>> request-list...<span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><br>
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>>>><span> </span><a><span style="color:purple">[hidden email]</span></a><span> </span><br>
>>>><span> </span><a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cat-interop" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://lists.osgeo.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cat-interop</span></a><br>
>>><span> </span><br>
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