<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=windows-1252"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">Hey Andrew,<div><br></div><div>(my response is a personal response, not a board response).<br><div><div><br></div><div>First off I’d like to thank you for the kind offer of working together. I want to make sure we discuss this at the board level and hopefully come to some consensus on this.</div><div><br></div><div>Personally I am very interested to see what this collaboration could bring both parties.</div><div><br></div><div>Best regards,</div><div>Bart</div><div><br><div><div>On 15 Aug 2014, at 05:51, Andrew Ross <<a href="mailto:andrew.ross@eclipse.org">andrew.ross@eclipse.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div>Hey Jeff, Everyone<br>
<br>
I'd like to comment briefly.<br>
<br>
I feel a 800+ person conference is of a sufficient size that it's not a good idea to burn out volunteers organizing. To throw a new team to the wolves each year is extremely risky.<br>
<br>
The obvious options are to not have such a large event, or choose a different model to organize.<br>
<br>
I feel that a conference of such size is very important. It's what draws the ecosystem together and helps it grow. Not having the large event would be a loss.<br>
<br>
It is simply too big to hold at most Universities, and especially in the fall.<br>
<br>
For what it's worth, I also feel smaller regional and plenty of local events are important too. That's orthogonal to the global event though.<br>
<br>
I've been open about what the Eclipse Foundation & LocationTech can do. It has full time staff with experience to run a consistently great technology conferences with lots of camaraderie.<br>
<br>
Let's work together. FOSS4G NA 2015 will be a nice opportunity, test, and display. For those who are highly motivated, feel free to go back to the D.C. bid and provide feedback. I feel it was a great bid, credible, and a good indication of the kind of event we'd hold in the future. Maybe this is a good option to address many of the issues? Worth exploring a bit in any case.<br>
<br>
Andrew<br>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On August 14, 2014 9:54:49 AM EDT, Jeff McKenna <<a href="mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com">jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com</a>> wrote:<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<pre class="k9mail">Hi Darrell,<br><br>I can say that in 2011 I did bring this issue strongly, and very <br>publicly, to the OSGeo Board. I even proposed a part-time position to <br>manage the main FOSS4G conference (google 'foss4g advisor' for some <br>history and fun reading, all there outlined in a public wiki page forever).<br><br>Well, that didn't happen. And as you just mentioned, it's still needed.<br><br>Or, if that cannot happen, we need to realize this, and change our <br>mindset, back to the origins of FOSS4G: a meeting of the tribe, cheap <br>admission, affordable university venues, bare-bones (essentially what <br>our FOSS4G regional events are doing now).<br><br>Because yes I agree, to assume a bunch of volunteers can run a ~1,000 <br>attendee event in the best conference venue in the city and still make <br>it affordable for the tribe to attend, will not work.<br><br>-jeff<br><br><br><br><br>On 2014-08-14 12:10 AM,
Darrell Fuhriman wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #729fcf; padding-left: 1ex;"> I’m trying to formulate a response to this, but it ties into an e-mail<br> that I owe this list, but haven’t had time to send because I’ve been<br> busy finalizing the conference preparations. Also, I’m well into my<br> third pint this evening, so it’s probably not the best time. :)<br><br> While I agree the early bird discount is important for the reasons you<br> state, there actually aren’t that many commitments that can be avoided<br> after the deadline. Frankly, the only significant contracts unsigned by<br> our early bird deadline of June 15th were the catering contracts. Though<br> admittedly, that’s a substantial portion of the budget – if we were on<br> that red line, we’d be jettisoning coffee breaks like ballast in a<br> sinking ship.<br><br> I think right now the quickest thing I
can say is that OSGeo has so far<br> shown minimal interest in actually taking responsibility for FOSS4G. If<br> OSGeo is going to increase the demands made on the committee, OSGeo<br> needs to be stepping up and taking a more hands-on approach to<br> conference organization.<br><br> For the record, I believe OSGeo needs to step up and take such a more<br> hands on approach. I’d love a chance to talk about in person at the<br> board meeting.<br><br> <a href="http://sotm.us/">SotM.us</a> <<a href="http://sotm.us/">http://SotM.us</a>> runs very different, and I know from talking<br> with the organizers that it was a challenge to break-even this year. The<br> difficulty is that as conferences get bigger, they get more expensive to<br> put on (primarily because the supply of possible venues shrinks very<br> rapidly, and the per attendee costs go up substantially). They also get<br> logistically more challenging, and having dedicated resources,
either<br> employee or outsourced, can vastly decrease the workload on the LOC.<br> Frankly, unless something changes on this front, it’s just a matter of<br> time until there’s another 2012. To be honest, I’m not sure <a href="http://sotm.us/">SotM.us</a><br> <<a href="http://sotm.us/">http://SotM.us</a>> would have been a success if Mapbox hadn’t devoted<br> significant employee resources to making sure it was (as they have for<br> the past three <a href="http://sotm.us/">SotM.us</a> <<a href="http://sotm.us/">http://SotM.us</a>> conferences). Conferences take<br> huge numbers of hours to organize. The inefficiency introduced by having<br> someone re-learn the job every year is substantial, wasteful, and<br> incredibly risky.<br><br> Anyway, I’m supposed to be on vacation.<br><br> Greetings from Yellowstone,<br><br> Darrell<br><br><br> On Aug 13, 2014, at 13:41, Cameron Shorter <<a href="mailto:cameron.shorter@gmail.com">cameron.shorter@gmail.com</a><br>
<<a href="mailto:cameron.shorter@gmail.com">mailto:cameron.shorter@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"> I'm open to the idea of providing benefits to osgeo charter members,<br> but suggest having an early bird discount apply to all ticket<br> categories. I'd suggest something like a 5% discount for charter<br> member tickets instead.<br><br> Note: conferences organisors need to decide whether they will also<br> give such a discount to professional bodies as well (such as<br> professional institute of surveyors). Such organisations often<br> aggressively request a discount for their members in return for<br> publicising foss4g to their membership.<br><br> There is a very important reason conferences have a early bird<br> discount. It means that conference organisors get an early indication<br> of the number of attendees coming to the conference. This helps<br> significantly with
regards to making financial decisions about the<br> conference. In particular, it enables organisors to decide to cancel<br> the conference before having to lock into key financial commitments<br> and potentially sending OSGeo bankrupt. This was very important for us<br> in FOSS4G 2009, the year of the global financial crisis, when<br> registrations were much lower than expected. At the early bird<br> deadline, we were aware that we had enough people attending that we<br> would loose less money by going ahead than if we cancelled, so we went<br> ahead. Without that confidence, we likely would have decided to cancel<br> the conference. (In the end more people did register, and we were just<br> able to make a modest profit.)<br><br> On 14/08/2014 4:56 am, Kate Chapman wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> Hi All,<br><br> I think the comparison between the SotM model
and the FOSS4G model is<br> interesting, but it is important to think about the financial<br> objectives of each conference. My understanding was that FOSS4G<br> provides most of the funding for OSGEO over the year, this isn't the<br> case for SotM. Though successful sponsorship programs could possibly<br> make up the difference between the discounted tickets.<br><br> One note, I've worked for a few organizations that have paid my<br> ticket for SotM. I've also paid the mapper price myself previously as<br> well. I would have not been able to get them to pay for FOSS4G<br> though. Some of you may have noticed I have given a workshop every<br> year I've attended FOSS4G. I would not be able to attend otherwise.<br> Not that it is conceivable for everyone to give a workshop to be able<br> to attend.<br><br> Best,<br><br> -Kate<br><br><br> On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 11:46 AM, Daniel Kastl <<a href="mailto:daniel@georepublic.de">daniel@georepublic.de</a><br>
<<a href="mailto:daniel@georepublic.de">mailto:daniel@georepublic.de</a>>> wrote:<br><br><br> SotM finances are based on the expectation that most people<br> attending will be ‘mappers’ who pay the lower rate, I doubt<br> they make much money from the business tickets.<br><br><br> Hi Steven,<br><br> I agree that SotM is a bit extreme in the price difference. It<br> doesn't need to be that much. But I can speak for SotM Tokyo,<br> where I was involved, and there were more business tickets sold<br> than I expected and they made up a large share of the total<br> revenue through ticket sales.<br><br> My main point is, that for delegates, who get paid the conference<br> by their employer, a slightly higher price doesn't really matter<br> (it's just a fraction of the total cost anyway), because they<br> just pass the costs to the employer. For the employer it has a<br> value, if one can see the company name on
the badge.<br> But someone from nearby for example or tries to keep the travel<br> costs low and takes a holiday to attend FOSS4G, such a discounted<br> community ticket makes a difference, whether the person is a<br> charter member or not.<br> I think we should strengthen the value of the community, not the<br> "club" of charter members. ;-)<br><br> Daniel<br> --<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><hr><br>Conference_dev mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Conference_dev@lists.osgeo.org">Conference_dev@lists.osgeo.org</a><br><a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev</a><br><br></pre></blockquote></div></div>_______________________________________________<br>Conference_dev mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Conference_dev@lists.osgeo.org">Conference_dev@lists.osgeo.org</a><br>http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev</blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></body></html>