<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Michael has summed this up way better than I could, i agree with him 100%<br class=""><div class="">
<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; ">______<br class="">Steven<br class=""><br class=""></span>
</div>
<div style=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On 14 Sep 2018, at 18:59, michael terner <<a href="mailto:ternergeo@gmail.com" class="">ternergeo@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">Steven et al:</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">Thanks for relaying the message on the videoing. </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif"><br class=""></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">To all:</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">Indeed, providing the "LOC perspective on videoing" has been a bit of a personal cause as it was an extremely challenging part of Boston. I have posted to the Conference Dev on this previously and will continue to do so, as I believe it is an important and challenging issue that other LOCs are likely to face. Indeed, both Steven and Til have conveyed the core elements of the challenge. Here are a few additional points and a rationale for having OSGeo <i class="">directly support </i>the funding of videoing:</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif"><br class=""></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif"><i class="">Full disclosure: </i>As a member of the Conference Dev Committee and as Charter Member, I fully support the goal of videoing as much of a FOSS4G conference as is possible. As a conference chair, the calculus is a bit more difficult.</div><div class="gmail_default" style=""><ol style="" class=""><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">Videoing is not easy, nor inexpensive. It is to the Bonn Team's great credit, and also to their supplier Kaos Klub's (sic) credit that they <i class="">made it look easy.</i> And in the end, they were affordable.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">The Boston Team was so impressed with Kaos Klub that we tried earnestly to bring them to Boston. Ultimately, they were not able to commit to supporting us.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">The primary goal of an LOC is to provide the best possible experience for <i class="">those who attend the event. </i>Hosting a FOSS4G is first and foremost <i class="">for the visitors to your city</i> and your paying customers and sponsors.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">Videoing adds great value to OSGeo in being able to keep the presentations in perpetuity and to use them in a marketing and educational context. Equally, OSGeo has a broader mandate than an LOC to widen the reach of a FOSS4G conference to people who are unable to attend.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">Yes, Steven is correct, in cities like Boston, there are limited options for videoing. At our venue, the venue <i class="">required</i> we use their in-house video for the main, plenary room (3 screens, multiple cameras, etc. etc.). The cost of that was in excess of $50,000. The estimated cost to video 11 rooms concurrently was also in excess of $50,000 (although we were free to pursue other options for those rooms), so the overall budget would have exceeded $100,000.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">While we knew the budget, we needed to make a decisions on the videoing approach 3 months before the conference. That is, at a time when we had only 500+ registrants and knew that we needed 800 registrations to break even. At that time, we were unable to make a commitment to spend $50,000 that we did not have in hand. And so we chose to do-it-yourself (DIY), which was estimated to cost $15,000 - $20,000 including buying the equipment.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">Guido led a team that did incredible work and we successfully captured video of 80%+ of the sessions DIY and with volunteers operating the equipment. But Guido's team was extremely stressed, almost to the point of breaking during the <i class="">entire conference.</i> And then, after the conference, we had huge piles of video to edit and merge (i.e., slides + speaker video) and upload.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">But in the end, we achieved a very healthy surplus. Had we known in advance that we would have that surplus, there is no possible way we would have chosen DIY. We would have spent the $50,000. (And indeed, we paid for processing and uploading the video by using a contractor <i class="">after the conference.</i>)</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">From my POV, <b class="">requiring videoing</b> while providing <u class="">no</u> direct financial support, and as Til points out, at the same time pushing LOCs hard to maintain affordability, is neither fair, nor equitable to the LOC. Videoing is in OSGeo's direct interests (far more than the LOC's) and if it's very important, than OSGeo should be prepared to pay for it.</font></li><li style="" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">The scheme that Steven and I proposed in an earlier draft is a fair approach that would have made an enormous difference to Boston. Basically, OSGeo loans the LOC the money to pay for videoing (or a large proportion of the videoing) and then the first bit of the surplus is used to pay back that loan. If there is no surplus, then loan is not repayed, and OSGeo does in fact pay for the videoing, <i class="">to its own great benefit</i>.</font></li></ol><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">If OSGeo is not willing to pay for the videoing, how is it fair to have the LOC (or rather, the paying attendees) pay for it? Indeed, in Dar es Salaam, the DLOC made the intentional choice of only videoing the plenary sessions and saving money. Money that was used to broaden attendance <i class="">at the conference</i> through discount tickets for local people. Part of that decision was informed by looking at the Boston video viewing stats. Indeed, our keynotes had many hundreds of views, but a typical session had 20 - 30 viewings over the past year. That is non-trivial, but "how much" is that worth? I believe the DLOC made the right call in erring on bringing <i class="">more people to Dar.</i></font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class=""><i class=""><br class=""></i></font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">I recognize and respect that this issue is not resolved. And the best possible solution (which Astrid described to Steven and myself) would be some kind of "video team" (or other resources) that could be deployed to FOSS4G conferences (where ever they may be held) and that could provide the videoing services at an affordable cost. I certainly hope that is what happens at Bucharest. But if such a solution is not possible, then I believe it is fair and appropriate that OSGeo invest in the videoing that it believes is important enough to state as a requirement in the RfP. Since it does not appear that OSGeo is yet comfortable making that commitment, then I would concur with Steven that video should not be made a "hard requirements" and should rather be listed as a "strong preference."</font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class=""><br class=""></font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">I am confident we will find a good long term approach for this challenge. But the challenge is real and needs some action from OSGeo.</font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class=""><br class=""></font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">Most sincerely, and over & out from the Dar es Salaam airport on my way back to Boston...</font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class=""><br class=""></font></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">MT</font></div></div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="">On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 7:19 AM Till Adams <<a href="mailto:till.adams@fossgis.de" class="">till.adams@fossgis.de</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" class=""><p class="">Hi Steven,</p><p class="">thanks for finishing the document!</p><p class="">I totally agree in the fact, that on the one hand we can't
increase our requirements more and more, on the other hand we want
to keep the price as low as possible. Somewhere there has to be a
balance and this is lived by the LOCs. <br class="">
</p><p class="">As long as the bidders clearly describe how they deal with the
individual things, the final decision lies with the selection of
the proposal and with that, it is still in the hands of OSGeo.</p><p class="">So I would leave the video section(s) as they are and finish the
document *now*<br class="">
</p><p class="">Till<br class="">
</p><p class=""><br class="">
</p>
<br class="">
<div class="m_-4808324397058902602moz-cite-prefix">Am 14.09.2018 um 11:09 schrieb Steven
Feldman:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
I have cleared the last few comments and hopefully have resolved
the AGM and the member meeting in a way that will acceptable to
the board. I think we are making clear to bidders that they need
to provide space for these events <b class="">within</b> the
programme.
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">When we award the event to a LOC I think we should
draft a formal letter of award that includes a list of
conditions which could include approval of the scheduling of the
OSGeo AGM etc.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">The funding of video recording is going to have to
be left unresolved. At the moment all that we are saying is that
we want recording and that OSGeo “may” provide a loan. The
provision of recording is quite contentious amongst recent
chairs:</div>
<div class="">
<ul class="m_-4808324397058902602MailOutline">
<li class="">Prior to Bonn there was no large scale video
recording to my knowledge. At Nottingham we had Audio
recording</li>
<li class="">Bonn set a very high standard thanks to the team
of external specialist volunteers who took on the task</li>
<li class="">Boston did an incredible job using home built
systems but it was an enormous strain on the LOC and the
volunteers to get this done. An external team would have
cost close on $100k I believe (MT?) and that would have
added $80+ to the ticket price or eliminated most of the
surplus returned to OSGeo</li>
<li class="">Dar only recorded the keynotes and some sessions
in the main hall, I believe that this was due to a
combination of cost and organisation (MI?)</li>
</ul>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">People outside of the LOC are always keen that the
proceedings are recorded and made available to a wider
audience, I understand why. The LOC may well be concerned at
the cost of hiring in a professional team to record up to 9
streams of content or the administrative burden of trying to
record using an in-house team of volunteers. </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I’d prefer to leave recording as a strongly
desired but not mandatory requirement (also seek clarity on
whether all sessions will be recorded) and remove the section
on an OSGeo loan as that will make matters more complex.
Others will have a different view. We need to make a decision
and get the RfP out. I can edit the video sections of the RfP
once there is a decision.</div>
<div class="">
<span class="m_-4808324397058902602Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse:separate;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;line-height:normal;border-spacing:0px">______<br class="">
Steven<br class="">
<br class="">
</span>
</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On 14 Sep 2018, at 08:49, Till Adams <<a href="mailto:till.adams@fossgis.de" target="_blank" class="">till.adams@fossgis.de</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="m_-4808324397058902602Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div class="">Dear all,<br class="">
<br class="">
I tried to resolve all the comments in<br class="">
<br class="">
<a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/14ltOnAoiFSTl7ERdlFKUvx-Jh9eDpVQgEn4AoCIp4SE/edit?ts=5b9a347f#" target="_blank" class="">https://docs.google.com/document/d/14ltOnAoiFSTl7ERdlFKUvx-Jh9eDpVQgEn4AoCIp4SE/edit?ts=5b9a347f#</a><br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
and ended up with 2 remaining.<br class="">
<br class="">
One is a discussion between Steven and Maria regarding
length and<br class="">
scheduling for AGM, the other one is a comment of
Cameron regarding the<br class="">
potential funding of the video recording.<br class="">
<br class="">
Can the people I named please resolve these comments?
After that we can<br class="">
export the document and ask somebody who knows how to to
load it into<br class="">
the SVN and send the link. Afterwards I will kick the
call out.<br class="">
<br class="">
Many thanks to all contributions!<br class="">
<br class="">
Till<br class="">
<br class="">
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</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="">
</div>
</blockquote>
<br class="">
</div>
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<a href="https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/conference_dev</a></blockquote></div><br clear="all" class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div>-- <br class=""><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">Michael Terner</font></div><div class=""><a href="mailto:ternergeo@gmail.com" target="_blank" class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">ternergeo@gmail.com</font></a></div><div class=""><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" class="">(M) 978-631-6602</font></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
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