<div dir="ltr">Oh I see ... I kind of think we should trust the projects for a bit (when listing the standards) and then work with the OGC on getting our OSGeo Projects certified (so they can have the official stickers). There is such a large gap of commitment between implementing a standard and being certified ...<div><br></div><div>We spoke with the OGC about this kind of thing as part of the sponsors, partners, friends breakfast meeting.</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>--</div><div>Jody Garnett</div></div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On 23 August 2017 at 14:32, Basques, Bob (CI-StPaul) <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bob.basques@ci.stpaul.mn.us" target="_blank">bob.basques@ci.stpaul.mn.us</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">
Jody,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I meant that sometime an application uses the Standards, but doesn’t really support them (per OGC specifications). GeoMoose for example can read and write out WMS and WFS via MapServer. And in it’s latest incarnation even read WFS directly.
Some of these capabilities adhere to the OGC spec’s for “supports”, but some don’t.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div><br>
<div><span class="">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Aug 23, 2017, at 3:52 PM, Jody Garnett <<a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank">jody.garnett@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="m_-6528244511240596980Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Do you mean the difference between clients and servers? I would hope WMS support in OpenLayers is clearly distinct from WMS support in MapServer.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div></span>
GeoMoose as an installation, serves up WMS/WFS via MapServer. It can also act as (at least) a WFS client and read from WFS directly.</div>
<div><span class=""><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Can you clarify bobb, standards are confusing / intimidating enough as it is (especially for projects that implement a wall of them).</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div></span>
I’m just trying to caution against using blanket statements of support is all, and hopefully present some real world examples to back up my statements.<span class=""><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Ideally I would like to see projects that are certified by OGC place the correct logos on these pages.</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div></span>
I guess that’s where I’m going with this, GeoMoose has not gone through the process of certifing it’s OGC standards. They have a very specific process to do this too, and based on that I’m saying that GeoMoose for one, would not be 100% compliant, as an example.
Some pieces could be though.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So we just say we can use those standards and have support for some of them vs having (100%) OGC compliance.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>bobb</div><div><div class="h5">
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div class="m_-6528244511240596980gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>--</div>
<div>Jody Garnett</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 23 August 2017 at 08:47, Basques, Bob (CI-StPaul) <span dir="ltr">
<<a href="mailto:bob.basques@ci.stpaul.mn.us" target="_blank">bob.basques@ci.stpaul.mn.us</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">All,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>“Support for” and “able to use” should be separate criteria in the OGC capabilities (I think) as well.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>bobb</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div class="m_-6528244511240596980h5"><br>
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Aug 22, 2017, at 1:41 PM, Jeff McKenna <<a href="mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com" target="_blank">jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com</a><wbr>> wrote:</div>
<br class="m_-6528244511240596980m_-8702417762473717855Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<div>In our case, nesting won't help (if project XXX selects "OGC" as its standards support in the wordpress backend, the reader of our site will assume that all OGC standards are met by project XXX - so yes I agree that the best thing is to delete
the single "OGC" option.<br>
<br>
As for other "standards", we will need to specify that somehow.<br>
<br>
Possibly we can specify this directly in the description? For example:<br>
<br>
Web Processing Service (WPS)<br>
<br>
would become:<br>
<br>
OGC: Web Processing Service (WPS)<br>
<br>
<br>
and<br>
<br>
Georeferenced Tagged Image File Format (GeoTIFF)<br>
<br>
would become:<br>
<br>
Other: Web Processing Service (WPS)<br>
<br>
<br>
thoughts?<br>
<br>
-jeff<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2017-08-22 3:22 PM, Jeff McKenna wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Note that the issue here is not nested or not; the issue is that we must be careful with the use of the word "standard" on our new site. -jeff<br>
On 2017-08-22 3:11 PM, Jody Garnett wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Never mind, you can have nesting, so OGC can contain WFS, WMS, WCS, etc...<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Jody Garnett<br>
<br>
On 22 August 2017 at 11:09, Jody Garnett <<a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank">jody.garnett@gmail.com</a> <<a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank">mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com</a><wbr>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
You can click on the number, in this case 11, and see a list of the<br>
projects implementing the OGC standard. I am deleting it now...<br>
<br>
--<br>
Jody Garnett<br>
<br>
On 22 August 2017 at 10:17, Even Rouault <<a href="mailto:even.rouault@spatialys.com" target="_blank">even.rouault@spatialys.com</a><br>
<<a href="mailto:even.rouault@spatialys.com" target="_blank">mailto:even.rouault@spatialys<wbr>.com</a>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
__<br>
<br>
On mardi 22 août 2017 14:07:04 CEST Jeff McKenna wrote:<br>
<br>
> Many of these don't make any sense to me, if you ask me my opinion. We<br>
<br>
> should be using the list of OGC standards and entering them into<br>
<br>
> wordpress, and not allowing editors to edit/add new non-standards. But<br>
<br>
> that is all my own opinion :) Then we can link to these standards. As<br>
<br>
> of now anyone can create a 'standard' and post it on the beta site,<br>
<br>
> seems very odd to me.<br>
<br>
Just a remainder that OGC is not the only source of standards.<br>
For example, GeoJSON is IETF RFC 7946 for example (and before<br>
last year, was a community standard). GeoTIFF can also be<br>
considered as a defacto standard, etc.. You have also the ISO<br>
standards for metadata, etc...<br>
<br>
Probably a loose definition for standards could be a<br>
specification available somewhere (potentially behind a paywall<br>
like ISO...), and implemented by at least several software/vendors.<br>
<br>
Even<br>
<br>
><br>
<br>
> Is my opinion here too strong? For now I chose just to edit the<br>
<br>
> descriptions for all of these 'standards', valid or not.<br>
<br>
><br>
<br>
> What do you prefer?<br>
<br>
><br>
<br>
> -jeff<br>
<br>
><br>
<br>
> On 2017-08-22 1:59 PM, Jody Garnett wrote:<br>
<br>
> > Thanks jeff, I just noticed that work had been done in the<br>
GeoServer<br>
<br>
> > meeting :) We also spotted one standard "OGC" which does<br>
not make sense.<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > Do you think it is worthwhile linking to these standards?<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > --<br>
<br>
> > Jody Garnett<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > On 22 August 2017 at 09:42, Jeff McKenna<br>
<<a href="mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com" target="_blank">jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com</a><br>
<<a href="mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com" target="_blank">mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomat<wbr>ics.com</a>><br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > <<a href="mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com" target="_blank">mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomat<wbr>ics.com</a><br>
<<a href="mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomatics.com" target="_blank">mailto:jmckenna@gatewaygeomat<wbr>ics.com</a>>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> > Since we have so many website 'editors' (currently 84),<br>
please if<br>
<br>
> > you do create a new "standard" (double-quote use is on<br>
purpose, as<br>
<br>
> > many of these are not actual standards) when you are<br>
editing your<br>
<br>
> > project page, please let me know and I will edit the new<br>
standard<br>
<br>
> > and add a description - I have just went through all of these<br>
<br>
> > "standards" and set descriptions for each of the 27<br>
"standards".<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > For example:<br>
<br>
> > (WPS)<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > will now appear on the project pages as:<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > Web Processing Service (WPS)<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > This consistency makes it much easier to read for new users<br>
to our<br>
<br>
> > site.<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > thanks all!<br>
<br>
> ><br>
<br>
> > -jeff<br>
<br>
><br>
<br>
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Spatialys - Geospatial professional services<br>
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<a href="http://www.spatialys.com/" target="_blank">http://www.spatialys.com</a><br>
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<dt>"The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who don't have it."<span class="m_-6528244511240596980m_-8702417762473717855Apple-converted-space"> </span></dt><dd>- George Bernard Shaw
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