<div dir="ltr">Agreed, and we will start that discussion (again) shortly.<div><br></div><div>One of the key benefits of OSGeo is an organization is the ability to be inclusive, going to see if we can take that message out to the projects. Ideally I would like to to make joining "OSGeo Technology" easier that joining "OSGeo Live" distribution which is easier than joining "OSGeo Projects".</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>--</div><div>Jody Garnett</div></div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On 5 February 2016 at 13:02, Cameron Shorter <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cameron.shorter@gmail.com" target="_blank">cameron.shorter@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
    Hi Jody,<br>
    So you want to allow suitable projects join OSGeo? Sure, that is the
    concept behind OSGeo Labs. Any project can list itself so long as it
    is Open Source and Geospatial. pgrouting is listed. [0]<br>
    <br>
    The problem is that many projects haven't joined. Why? Probably
    because a listing in OSGeo Labs is of little value. What is of value
    is a stamp of quality, which leads to attracting users, developers
    and sponsors.<br>
    <br>
    So go ahead and rename OSGeo-Labs if you like, but I think the real
    value and core conversation should be based around what value can we
    offer OSGeo-Lab projects?<br>
    <br>
    [0] <a href="https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Labs" target="_blank">https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Labs</a><div><div class="h5"><br>
    <br>
    <div>On 6/02/2016 7:21 am, Jody Garnett
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">It is slightly more than a badge/marketing Cameron,
        we are looking to include projects in our software foundation
        (which has resources to devote to their wellbeing).
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>I am concerned that we are having two conversations here:
          one about the badge and a second one about inclusion.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>We as an organization demand a few things (open source, no
          really open source did you check) and open development that
          may be new to the project teams involved. We also have some
          requirements around the risk associated with the use of
          project (user community, documentation, developer maturity,
          and project viability) which is unusual.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>The badge is a bit of a bike shed problem (accessible to
          all but a distraction from the discussion).</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>I am focused on address the inclusion (so projects like
          pgRouting can have a home with OSGeo).</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
        <div>
          <div>
            <div dir="ltr">
              <div>
                <div dir="ltr">
                  <div>--</div>
                  <div>Jody Garnett</div>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
        </div>
        <br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On 5 February 2016 at 11:28, Cameron
          Shorter <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cameron.shorter@gmail.com" target="_blank">cameron.shorter@gmail.com</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> I like Andrea's
              approach to this question by flipping the problem.<br>
              <br>
              Lets first ask: what is the value from a label such as
              "OSGeo Incubated"? It is a badge of quality which new
              users can quickly recognise to help select projects they
              might use.<br>
              <br>
              OSGeo-Live provides another badge of quality. OSGeo-Live
              guarantees that a project has been tested and verified to
              work on the OSGeo-Live linux distribution. Its main
              selection criteria is that the project is stable, and the
              community are willing to keep it maintained (with docs and
              data). OSGeo-Live's selection criteria [1] is lower than
              for OSGeo Incubation, and could be integrated with a
              greater OSGeo badge system.<br>
              <br>
              So what I believe we are looking for is a set of well
              defined project qualities, with each quality earning a
              badge. Some of these qualities can be automatically
              applied, as generated by OpenHub metrics [2].<br>
              Others could be opted into, by the project themselves,
              similar to the OSGeo Advocate categories [3].<br>
              And the harder, but more valued badges are those requiring
              a manual testing process, as provided by the OSGeo
              Incubation Checklist. [4] Note, the value and prestige of
              this badge is determined by the quality insisted upon
              before the badge is allocated.<br>
              <br>
              [1]
              <a href="https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc#How_to_add_a_project_to_OSGeoLive" target="_blank">https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc#How_to_add_a_project_to_OSGeoLive</a><br>
              [2] <a href="http://live.osgeo.org/en/metrics.html" target="_blank">http://live.osgeo.org/en/metrics.html</a><br>
              [3] <a href="https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Advocate#Understanding_OSGeo_roles" target="_blank">https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Advocate#Understanding_OSGeo_roles</a><br>
              [4] <a href="http://www.osgeo.org/incubator/process/project_graduation_checklist.html" target="_blank">http://www.osgeo.org/incubator/process/project_graduation_checklist.html</a>
              <div>
                <div><br>
                  <br>
                  <div>On 5/02/2016 7:42 pm, Andrea Aime wrote:<br>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote type="cite">
                    <div dir="ltr">Silly idea maybe, but what if you
                      look at the problem at the other way,
                      <div>and simply allow projects to show a logo
                        showing they symphatize for OSGeo,</div>
                      <div>and have them start incubation when they are
                        somehow ready to?</div>
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      <div>Steal a page from OGC, one can say they are
                        "implementing" a standard without checks (which</div>
                      <div>just mean they tried, but also shows support
                        for OGC), and then you can go though the</div>
                      <div>formal process and get actually certified, if
                        you want to.</div>
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      <div>Cheers</div>
                      <div>Andrea</div>
                    </div>
                    <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                      <div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at
                        11:21 PM, Jody Garnett <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank">jody.garnett@gmail.com</a>></span>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                          <div dir="ltr">I will point out that naming is
                            a classic bike shed problem. I think we
                            should ask the projects in "labs" and get
                            their take on this.</div>
                          <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                            <div>
                              <div>
                                <div dir="ltr">
                                  <div>
                                    <div dir="ltr">
                                      <div>--</div>
                                      <div>Jody Garnett</div>
                                    </div>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <div>
                              <div> <br>
                                <div class="gmail_quote">On 4 February
                                  2016 at 13:12, Landon Blake <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:sunburned.surveyor@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:sunburned.surveyor@gmail.com" target="_blank">sunburned.surveyor@gmail.com</a>></span>
                                  wrote:<br>
                                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                    <div dir="ltr">I like "Innovator".
                                      What about "Community Builder
                                      Project"?<span><font color="#888888">
                                          <div><br>
                                          </div>
                                          <div>Landon</div>
                                        </font></span></div>
                                    <div>
                                      <div>
                                        <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                          <div class="gmail_quote">On
                                            Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 12:22
                                            PM, Jody Garnett <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank">jody.garnett@gmail.com</a>></span>
                                            wrote:<br>
                                            <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                              <div dir="ltr">I hear you,
                                                and you are correct that
                                                innovation can happen
                                                anywhere. I look forward
                                                to alternate name
                                                suggestions.
                                                "Experiment" would do a
                                                disservice to a
                                                completed project that
                                                does not yet have a
                                                large/diverse enough
                                                community to meet our
                                                graduation requirements.
                                                <div><br>
                                                  <div>My fellow board
                                                    members were a bit
                                                    startled that our
                                                    incubation policies
                                                    do inhibit the
                                                    support smaller
                                                    projects, and would
                                                    like an avenue to
                                                    support innovation.
                                                    It may be that both
                                                    these objectives
                                                    cannot be met with
                                                    the same initiative,
                                                    but I would like to
                                                    try.</div>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                                                <div>
                                                  <div>
                                                    <div dir="ltr">
                                                      <div>
                                                        <div dir="ltr">
                                                          <div>--</div>
                                                          <div>Jody
                                                          Garnett</div>
                                                        </div>
                                                      </div>
                                                    </div>
                                                  </div>
                                                </div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <div> <br>
                                                    <div class="gmail_quote">On
                                                      3 February 2016 at
                                                      23:47, Jeroen
                                                      Ticheler <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jeroen.ticheler@geocat.net" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:jeroen.ticheler@geocat.net" target="_blank">jeroen.ticheler@geocat.net</a>></span>
                                                      wrote:<br>
                                                      <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi

                                                        Jody,<br>
                                                        I understand the
                                                        naming
                                                        confusion. The
                                                        Innovator name
                                                        however has IMO
                                                        a negative
                                                        reflection on
                                                        the established
                                                        projects. Are
                                                        new projects
                                                        necessarily more
                                                        innovative than
                                                        established
                                                        ones? Often they
                                                        are still so
                                                        small they don't
                                                        have established
                                                        communities/structures
                                                        etc in place.
                                                        That's indeed
                                                        why the Labs
                                                        were created.<br>
                                                        I will think
                                                        about another
                                                        potential name
                                                        and I hope
                                                        others feel the
                                                        same and will
                                                        also think of an
                                                        alternative
                                                        naming for the
                                                        Labs. I remember
                                                        you saying
                                                        something like
                                                        Hatching
                                                        (synonym of
                                                        incubating, so
                                                        maybe to co
                                                        fusing).<br>
                                                        Maybe OSGeo
                                                        Experiments.<br>
                                                        Cheers,<br>
                                                        Jeroen<br>
                                                        <br>
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_________________________<br>
                                                        Jeroen Ticheler<br>
                                                        GeoCat bv<br>
                                                        Veenderweg 13<br>
                                                        6721 WD Bennekom<br>
                                                        Tel: <a href="tel:%2B31%20%280%296%2081286572" value="+31681286572" target="_blank">+31
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                                                        <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          > Op 4 feb.
                                                          2016 om 03:25
                                                          heeft Jody
                                                          Garnett <<a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:jody.garnett@gmail.com" target="_blank">jody.garnett@gmail.com</a>>

                                                          het volgende
                                                          geschreven:<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > A couple
                                                          of results for
                                                          the incubation
                                                          team out of
                                                          the weekend's
                                                          board meeting.<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > We have
                                                          the "GeoForAll
                                                          Labs" and our
                                                          OSGeo labs
                                                          projects - and
                                                          the two names
                                                          trip on each
                                                          other.<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > Board
                                                          members were
                                                          also a bit
                                                          taken aback
                                                          that our
                                                          incubation
                                                          process is not
                                                          really
                                                          "welcome" to
                                                          innovation
                                                          (indeed our
                                                          graduation
                                                          requirements
                                                          tend to favour
                                                          established
                                                          projects).<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > With that
                                                          in mind - I
                                                          would like to
                                                          kick off:<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > 1)
                                                          Renaming OSGeo
                                                          Labs as OSGeo
                                                          Innovator<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > The
                                                          branding for
                                                          this is way
                                                          better for
                                                          projects!
                                                          Having an
                                                          "OSGeo
                                                          Innovator"
                                                          badge on your
                                                          home page is
                                                          way more
                                                          "positive" an
                                                          impression.<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > 2) Revise
                                                          the procedures
                                                          around this
                                                          activity<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > My first
                                                          take is:<br>
                                                          > - provide
                                                          a home for
                                                          small project
                                                          teams / single
                                                          organization
                                                          projects<br>
                                                          > - focus
                                                          on new
                                                          projects (so
                                                          provide
                                                          README,
                                                          CONTRIBUTING,
                                                          PSC files for
                                                          a project to
                                                          copy into
                                                          github)<br>
                                                          > - stick
                                                          to our "open
                                                          source" and
                                                          "open
                                                          development"
                                                          guns!<br>
                                                          > - "save
                                                          the sticker"
                                                          until
                                                          on-boarding is
                                                          complete<br>
                                                          > --<br>
                                                          > Jody
                                                          Garnett<br>
                                                          </div>
                                                        </div>
                                                        >
                                                        _______________________________________________<br>
                                                        > Incubator
                                                        mailing list<br>
                                                        > <a href="mailto:Incubator@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:Incubator@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">Incubator@lists.osgeo.org</a><br>
                                                        > <a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator" target="_blank">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator</a><br>
                                                      </blockquote>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <br>
                                                  </div>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                              <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                              Incubator mailing list<br>
                                              <a href="mailto:Incubator@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">Incubator@lists.osgeo.org</a><br>
                                              <a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator</a><br>
                                            </blockquote>
                                          </div>
                                          <br>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </div>
                                  </blockquote>
                                </div>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                          <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                          Incubator mailing list<br>
                          <a href="mailto:Incubator@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">Incubator@lists.osgeo.org</a><br>
                          <a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator</a><br>
                        </blockquote>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                      <br clear="all">
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      -- <br>
                      <div>
                        <div dir="ltr">
                          <div>
                            <div dir="ltr">
                              <div>
                                <div dir="ltr">
                                  <div>
                                    <div dir="ltr">
                                      <div>
                                        <div dir="ltr">
                                          <div dir="ltr">
                                            <div dir="ltr">
                                              <div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <div>==</div>
                                                  <div>GeoServer
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                                                    more information.</div>
                                                  <div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">==</span><br>
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                                                <div><br>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>Ing. Andrea Aime <br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>@geowolf</div>
                                              <div>Technical Lead</div>
                                              <div><br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>GeoSolutions S.A.S.</div>
                                              <div>Via Poggio alle Viti
                                                1187</div>
                                              <div>55054  Massarosa (LU)</div>
                                              <div>Italy</div>
                                              <div>phone: <a href="tel:%2B39%200584%20962313" value="+390584962313" target="_blank">+39
                                                  0584 962313</a></div>
                                              <div>fax: <a href="tel:%2B39%200584%201660272" value="+3905841660272" target="_blank">+39
                                                  0584 1660272</a></div>
                                              <div>mob: <a href="tel:%2B39%20%C2%A0339%208844549" value="+393398844549" target="_blank">+39
                                                   339 8844549</a></div>
                                              <div><br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div><a href="http://www.geo-solutions.it" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://www.geo-solutions.it" target="_blank">http://www.geo-solutions.it</a></div>
                                              <div><a href="http://twitter.com/geosolutions_it" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://twitter.com/geosolutions_it" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/geosolutions_it</a></div>
                                              <div><br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p><span lang="IT"><font size="1"><b>AVVERTENZE

                                                        AI SENSI DEL
                                                        D.Lgs. 196/2003</b></font></span></p>
                                                <p><span lang="IT"><font size="1">Le
                                                      informazioni
                                                      contenute in
                                                      questo messaggio
                                                      di posta
                                                      elettronica e/o
                                                      nel/i file/s
                                                      allegato/i sono da
                                                      considerarsi
                                                      strettamente
                                                      riservate. Il loro
                                                      utilizzo è
                                                      consentito
                                                      esclusivamente al
                                                      destinatario del
                                                      messaggio, per le
                                                      finalità indicate
                                                      nel messaggio
                                                      stesso. Qualora
                                                      riceviate questo
                                                      messaggio senza
                                                      esserne il
                                                      destinatario, Vi
                                                      preghiamo
                                                      cortesemente di
                                                      darcene notizia
                                                      via e-mail e di
                                                      procedere alla
                                                      distruzione del
                                                      messaggio stesso,
                                                      cancellandolo dal
                                                      Vostro sistema.
                                                      Conservare il
                                                      messaggio stesso,
                                                      divulgarlo anche
                                                      in parte,
                                                      distribuirlo ad
                                                      altri soggetti,
                                                      copiarlo, od
                                                      utilizzarlo per
                                                      finalità diverse,
                                                      costituisce
                                                      comportamento
                                                      contrario ai
                                                      principi dettati
                                                      dal D.Lgs.
                                                      196/2003.</font></span></p>
                                                <p><span lang="IT"><font size="1"> </font></span></p>
                                                <p><font size="1">The
                                                    information in this
                                                    message and/or
                                                    attachments, is
                                                    intended solely for
                                                    the attention and
                                                    use of the named
                                                    addressee(s) and may
                                                    be confidential or
                                                    proprietary in
                                                    nature or covered by
                                                    the provisions of
                                                    privacy act
                                                    (Legislative Decree
                                                    June, 30 2003,
                                                    no.196 - Italy's New
                                                    Data Protection
                                                    Code).Any use not in
                                                    accord with its
                                                    purpose, any
                                                    disclosure,
                                                    reproduction,
                                                    copying,
                                                    distribution, or
                                                    either
                                                    dissemination,
                                                    either whole or
                                                    partial, is strictly
                                                    forbidden except
                                                    previous formal
                                                    approval of the
                                                    named addressee(s).
                                                    If you are not the
                                                    intended recipient,
                                                    please contact
                                                    immediately the
                                                    sender by telephone,
                                                    fax or e-mail and
                                                    delete the
                                                    information in this
                                                    message that has
                                                    been received in
                                                    error. The sender
                                                    does not give any
                                                    warranty or accept
                                                    liability as the
                                                    content, accuracy or
                                                    completeness of sent
                                                    messages and accepts
                                                    no responsibility 
                                                    for changes made
                                                    after they were sent
                                                    or for other risks
                                                    which arise as a
                                                    result of e-mail
                                                    transmission,
                                                    viruses, etc.</font></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div><br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>-------------------------------------------------------</div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </div>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                    <br>
                    <fieldset></fieldset>
                    <br>
                    <pre>_______________________________________________
Incubator mailing list
<a href="mailto:Incubator@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">Incubator@lists.osgeo.org</a>
<a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator" target="_blank">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator</a></pre>
                  </blockquote>
                  <br>
                </div>
              </div>
              <span><font color="#888888">
                  <pre cols="72">-- 
Cameron Shorter,
Software and Data Solutions Manager
LISAsoft
Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009

P <a href="tel:%2B61%202%209009%205000" value="+61290095000" target="_blank">+61 2 9009 5000</a>,  W <a href="http://www.lisasoft.com" target="_blank">www.lisasoft.com</a>,  F <a href="tel:%2B61%202%209009%205099" value="+61290095099" target="_blank">+61 2 9009 5099</a></pre>
                </font></span></div>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________<br>
            Incubator mailing list<br>
            <a href="mailto:Incubator@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">Incubator@lists.osgeo.org</a><br>
            <a href="http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/incubator</a><br>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <pre cols="72">-- 
Cameron Shorter,
Software and Data Solutions Manager
LISAsoft
Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009

P <a href="tel:%2B61%202%209009%205000" value="+61290095000" target="_blank">+61 2 9009 5000</a>,  W <a href="http://www.lisasoft.com" target="_blank">www.lisasoft.com</a>,  F <a href="tel:%2B61%202%209009%205099" value="+61290095099" target="_blank">+61 2 9009 5099</a></pre>
  </div></div></div>

</blockquote></div><br></div>