[mapguide-internals] Request for submission

Robert Bray rbray at robertbray.net
Wed Mar 28 13:58:27 EDT 2007


44 messages in March so far...

Bob

Paul Spencer wrote:
> w00t ... inbox ready to be filled!  I'm guessing that you are subscribed 
> to this, Bob, can you give us an indication of how much traffic you get 
> from trac?
> 
> Paul
> 
> On 28-Mar-07, at 1:11 PM, Robert Bray wrote:
> 
>> #3 already exists and has for some time.
>>
>>   mapguide-trac at lists.osgeo.org.
>>
>> I guess maybe I should have told someone/everyone that exists :)
>>
>> I am looking into enabling #4.
>>
>> Bob
>>
>> Paul Spencer wrote:
>>> Tom,
>>> The example you gave below would be useful to see both in the defect 
>>> and on the mailing list.  One way is to put the traffic on the 
>>> mailing list and then copy the appropriate info to the defect.  I 
>>> think this is quite possibly error prone because it relies on human 
>>> intervention (actually going to trac, finding the ticket, copying the 
>>> comment) and interpretation (is this really useful to put on the 
>>> ticket? nah, I'll remember that).
>>> Looking in Trac, I see 10 open issues (3 submitted by me!).  I highly 
>>> doubt that the amount of traffic coming from these tickets is going 
>>> to overwhelm anyone, especially if the traffic is mostly discussion 
>>> that would have happened on the list anyway.  I doubt this would 
>>> result in more than 1 email per day on average, probably 1 a week.
>>> So the suggestions on the table are:
>>> 1) status quo, we don't change anything and no-one on the internals 
>>> list will know about new tickets unless they go look
>>> 2) modify trac to cc mapguide-internals, the list will get emails for 
>>> everything that happens on all tickets
>>> 3) modify trac to cc a new mailing list (mapguide-tickets?) to which 
>>> only those who are interested can subscribe
>>> 4) modify trac to set mapguide-internals as the default owner of new 
>>> tickets.  The list will get traffic on the ticket until it gets 
>>> assigned to someone specific to deal with it, at which point people 
>>> can cc themselves on the issue if they are interested in following it
>>> 5) some combination of 4 and 2) or 3)
>>> I would like to see option 4) and option 3) implemented 
>>> simultaneously but I could live with either or option 2).  As long as 
>>> my email inbox fills up ...
>>> For patches submitted from the wild, we can encourage them to file a 
>>> ticket in trac.  Any discussion related to the patch should (IMO) go 
>>> in the ticket and to the list (automagically) until the patch has 
>>> been accepted or rejected.  If we go with 4), mapguide-internals 
>>> would stay the owner until the patch had been discussed and then 
>>> would be assigned to whoever wants to take responsibility for it.  
>>> Further discussion can safely happen on the ticket after the change 
>>> because anyone who is interested can cc themselves.
>>> What I would like to avoid is the situation where you are looking at 
>>> a ticket with a patch two months after it was submitted and think to 
>>> yourself "someone said something about these 5 lines of code and I 
>>> can't find it anywhere," or you forget the conversation ever took 
>>> place.  I am personally lazy and forgetful.  Any system that requires 
>>> me to do more than the minimum will ultimately fail for me ... and I 
>>> have a theory on human nature that indicates I'm not the only one ;)
>>> Cheers
>>> Paul
>>> On 28-Mar-07, at 12:43 AM, Tom Fukushima wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> Some more thoughts...
>>>>
>>>> The way I see things working: if someone without commit rights has a
>>>> patch to submit, they attach the patch to the ticket and send a note to
>>>> mapguide-internals that a patch has been submitted.  A committer picks
>>>> up the patch, reviews it and sends any feedback to mapguide-internals.
>>>> If the patch needs rework this process is repeated.
>>>>
>>>> To say what I was trying to say in my previous email differently: I
>>>> don't think that it makes sense to put feedback such as "did you
>>>> consider using method abc to replace the five lines in method y" in the
>>>> trac defect; this is globally useful information and everyone should 
>>>> see
>>>> it.
>>> This is where I disagree ... when you go to apply the patch, you then 
>>> have to go looking for the related email (if you remember it 
>>> happened).  By cc'ing the list, the info goes into the ticket where 
>>> it can be easily be found when the ticket is actioned and goes to the 
>>> list for general information.
>>>>
>>>> Paul, I think that this satisfies the "all discussion related to the
>>>> patch should take place in the ticket" requirement that you had
>>>> originally stated right? The patch review comments don't relate to the
>>>> defect, and instead relate to the code or techniques used in the patch
>>>> itself. If there are patch review comments that do provide information
>>>> for the defect, they need to be added to the defect.
>>>>
>>>> Tom
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: mapguide-internals-bounces at lists.osgeo.org
>>>> [mailto:mapguide-internals-bounces at lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Tom
>>>> Fukushima
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 11:57 AM
>>>> To: MapGuide Internals Mail List
>>>> Subject: RE: [mapguide-internals] Request for submission
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> 1) I think that the discussion should be on the mailing list; and then
>>>> any relevant parts should be copied to the trac defect after discussion
>>>> is completed. The reason for having the discussion on the mailing list
>>>> is so that we can all see what a submitters submissions are like; then
>>>> when it comes time to vote on whether to accept the patch submitter as
>>>> someone with actual commit rights, we will all have know the
>>>> capabilities of the person.
>>>>
>>>> 2) I like the idea of attaching the patch to the trac defect.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>> Tom
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: mapguide-internals-bounces at lists.osgeo.org
>>>> [mailto:mapguide-internals-bounces at lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Robert
>>>> Bray
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 8:31 AM
>>>> To: MapGuide Internals Mail List
>>>> Subject: Re: [mapguide-internals] Request for submission
>>>>
>>>> According to the book Producing FOSS by Karl Fogel discussion should 
>>>> not
>>>> take place in the tracker. To date I've been using that book to guide
>>>> many of our open source efforts. In the end I am not sure it is a big
>>>> deal but I'll let the rest of the PSC voice their thoughts.
>>>>
>>>> I do like the idea of new tickets showing up in a number of peoples
>>>> inbox to give them visibility, so in the meantime I'll look into how to
>>>> go about that.
>>>>
>>>> Bob
>>>>
>>>> Jason Birch wrote:
>>>>> Hmm.
>>>>>
>>>>> That approach would work well also.  I agree that new tickets don't
>>>>> really get enough visibility.  If we do this, we should also make sure
>>>>
>>>>> that we either set up something like Akismet to block spam, or require
>>>>
>>>>> a login for a ticket submission.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jason
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Paul Spencer
>>>>> Subject: Re: [mapguide-internals] Request for submission
>>>>>
>>>>> I personally think all patches should be filed as enhancements and all
>>>>
>>>>> discussion related to the patch should take place in the ticket so
>>>>> that everything related to that issue is in one place and can easily
>>>>> be found.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is what we have done in the past and it is very effective, no
>>>>> information is lost.  The reason it works is because the default owner
>>>>
>>>>> of new issues is a mailing list of people that are interested in new
>>>>> issues.  In this case, it would be very useful if new tickets could be
>>>>
>>>>> assigned to a default owner that is, in effect, the mapguide-
>>>>> internals list.  While the issue is not reassigned, all discussion
>>>>> would be tracked in both the bug and on the list.  Once assigned (i.e.
>>>>
>>>>> someone is going to do something about it), the mailing list user can
>>>>> be removed and anyone that is interested in following further can cc
>>>>> themselves to the bug.
>>>>>
>>>>> One thing that I have found with the current setup is that bugs just
>>>>> seem to disappear when filed.  No-one else seems to get notified that
>>>>> a new bug was created etc.  Perhaps that's not the case?
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> mapguide-internals mailing list
>>>>> mapguide-internals at lists.osgeo.org
>>>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/mapguide-internals
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> mapguide-internals at lists.osgeo.org
>>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/mapguide-internals
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/mapguide-internals
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/mapguide-internals
>>> +-----------------------------------------------------------------+
>>> |Paul Spencer                          pspencer at dmsolutions.ca    |
>>> +-----------------------------------------------------------------+
>>> |Chief Technology Officer                                         |
>>> |DM Solutions Group Inc                http://www.dmsolutions.ca/ |
>>> +-----------------------------------------------------------------+
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> mapguide-internals mailing list
>>> mapguide-internals at lists.osgeo.org
>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/mapguide-internals
>> _______________________________________________
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>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/mapguide-internals
> 
> +-----------------------------------------------------------------+
> |Paul Spencer                          pspencer at dmsolutions.ca    |
> +-----------------------------------------------------------------+
> |Chief Technology Officer                                         |
> |DM Solutions Group Inc                http://www.dmsolutions.ca/ |
> +-----------------------------------------------------------------+
> 
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