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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Chris –<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Well, now you’ve gone and made me
feel I have to add a little detail that I thought we could just sweep under the
rug for now <g>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If your aerial photos are indeed in the UTM
projection as we suspect, and you georeference them in your world file as if
they were latitude/longitude, it MIGHT seem to work over a small area.
But it will be subtly incorrect. If your image is really in UTM, and you
look at the corner coordinates in latitude/longitude you will find that the
latitude of the top left corner is NOT the same as the latitude of the top
right corner. In other words, the correct X coordinate of a pixel is a
function of both X and Y, and that’s not a concept you can express in
your world file. But if the area is small the difference (error) will
also be small, and it will look, at first glance, as if it works. But you
will see a positioning error that will vary in magnitude depending on your
position on the image, and the error drift in your markers sounds very much
like you’re seeing the problem I’m talking about.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If that’s the case, then correcting
the projection and world file to accurately describe the image as being in UTM
should correct the problem. You will also see the same symptom, of
course, if the problem is reversed and the image is in lat/lon but you’re
treating it like UTM. The best way to check is to calculate both the UTM
and lat/lon coordinates of all four corners of your image. It’s
supposed to be a rectangle, so the top left Y value should match the top right
Y value, the top right X value should match the bottom right X value,
etc. You should find that that holds true (or close to it) for only one
of your two coordinate systems – that’s the right one.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:33.0pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed
McNierney</span></font></st1:PersonName><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>TopoZone.com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> UMN MapServer
Users List [mailto:MAPSERVER-USERS@LISTS.UMN.EDU] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b><st1:PersonName w:st="on">Christopher Harris</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, September 27, 2007
12:24 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> MAPSERVER-USERS@LISTS.UMN.EDU<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [UMN_MAPSERVER-USERS]
Rasters, TileIndex and Shapefiles - Oh My! Really Confused</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Great! Ok. Well, it
looks like you've armed me with enough info to take over the world - at least
on my computer screen. You've cleared up a lot of mysteries that I've had
thus far. I'm going to go apply all this and see what explodes and
doesn't explode. I do have one problem I can think of with the app that I
already had created, but I'll wait to see if it goes away after I apply all of
this helpful info. I don't think it will. I'm pretty sure it
involves how I'm setting up my extents (Markers are always a few hundred yards
off and each marker that is located further north rotates north and east
following a circular counter-clockwise pattern). But, don't worry about
that now. I'll try and figure it out. <br>
<br>
Thanks, Ed. You are a very patient man and very nice too. Sorry it
took a while for me to see the light, but I usually learn best when seeing
examples, diagrams, pictures, etc. So, typically I'll have to draw or
write stuff out to get the idea. I'm more of a visual person when it
comes to memory.<br>
<br>
- Chris<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 15:03:47
-0400<br>
From: ed@TOPOZONE.COM<br>
Subject: Re: [UMN_MAPSERVER-USERS] Rasters, TileIndex and Shapefiles - Oh My!
Really Confused<br>
To: MAPSERVER-USERS@LISTS.UMN.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Chris –</span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>In my previous message (quoted below), I
said:</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'>#3 </span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>"The X pixel
dimension will be (maxx – minx) / xpixels, and the Y will be (miny
– maxy) / ypixels. You should find that the X number is -1 times
the Y number."</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>And that is correct. Maxx IS the
“greatest number in lat/lon or meters”, etc. Maxx –
minx will be a positive number, and miny – maxy (note that they’re
reversed) will be a negative number.</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:33.0pt;text-indent:-.25in'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>-</span></font><font size=1 color=navy><span style='font-size-adjust: none;
font-stretch: normal'><span style='font-size:7.0pt;color:navy'>
</span></span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed
McNierney</span></font></st1:PersonName><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>TopoZone.com</span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> UMN MapServer Users
List [mailto:MAPSERVER-USERS@LISTS.UMN.EDU] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On
Behalf Of </span></b><st1:PersonName w:st="on">Christopher Harris</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, September 27, 2007
11:49 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> MAPSERVER-USERS@LISTS.UMN.EDU<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [UMN_MAPSERVER-USERS]
Rasters, TileIndex and Shapefiles - Oh My! Really Confused<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'>Ok.....sorry it's taken me a while to post again. Got
caught up with something else.<br>
Considering the info and dimensions I have right now pending on what you say
about how I got those tiled images.<br>
<br>
In Lat/Lon:<br>
TL - lat = 40.117268<br>
lon = -88.248281<br>
<br>
BR - lat = 40.082274<br>
lon = -88.205980<br>
<br>
In Pixels:<br>
Image Width = 2602<br>
Image Height = 2800<br>
<br>
X pixel dimension:<br>
(-88.205980)-(-88.248281)
0.042301<br>
________________________ =
_____________ = 0.000016257 <br>
<br>
2602
2602<br>
<br>
Y pixel dimension:<br>
40.082277-40.117268
-0.034991<br>
________________________ =
_____________ = -0.000012497<br>
<br>
2800
2800<br>
<br>
Yeah, I see how I reversed them. I was thinking max was the greatest
number in lat/lon or meters and not in regard to the image and its coordinate
system. With the numbers provided so far, his should be right - right?<br>
<br>
- Chris<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Subject: RE: [UMN_MAPSERVER-USERS]
Rasters, TileIndex and Shapefiles - Oh My! Really Confused<br>
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:25:52 -0400<br>
From: ed@topozone.com<br>
To: docterrobert@msn.com; MAPSERVER-USERS@LISTS.UMN.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Chris –</span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>(I added the list back to the reply line
– please always reply to the whole list – thanks)</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A world file is in the units of the
image’s projection, not the other way around. Having a world file
does not mean the image is in UTM projection. The UTM projection is a
popular one, but it’s certainly not the only one. For a map in Illinois
UTM is certainly a possibility, but an Illinois State Plane Coordinate System
projection is also a possibility – especially if the original imagery
came from the State of Illinois. And geographic lat/lon coordinates are
also a possibility due to the increasing number of people in the world who seem
to think the Earth is flat (at least on the Web).</span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I don’t know which campus
you’re using, but if you’re at UIUC then the UTM coordinates will
be in UTM Zone 16 with values of around 395000 (X or Easting) 4440000 (Y
or Northing). If your numbers don’t look like those, they’re
not UTM.</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Oh, sorry – I started answering
before reading all the questions, and you later seem to confirm that your
coordinates are indeed UTM. But you got the formulas backwards, and X
should be positive while Y should be negative- not the other way around.
And the measurements in your world file are indeed in meters, but that’s
because those are the native units of the UTM projection being used.
There’s nothing that requires them to be in meters; many <st1:place
w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">US</st1:country-region></st1:place>
state plane coordinate systems use units of feet, and those would appear in the
world file, too.</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Now it is highly unlikely that your pixel
resolution is different in each dimension. You could average those two
numbers, or double-check your coordinate values (you didn’t say what
source you used to get them). If you got this image from a GIS source, I
would say that if you think the dimensions are different you’re wrong,
but who knows what the University did to munge the image into a pretty
picture. So maybe the dimensions ARE different; that’s not
impossible, just odd. I still would double-check your measurements and
math, but if you get the same answer that’s OK.</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Once you do that you just have to crank
out those world files!</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:33.0pt;text-indent:-.25in'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>-</span></font><font size=1 color=navy face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:7.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:navy'>
</span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ed
McNierney</span></font></st1:PersonName><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>TopoZone.com</span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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