[OpenLayers-Dev] OpenLayers 3.0 IRC Meeting summary

Tim Schaub tschaub at opengeo.org
Wed Jun 30 17:24:01 EDT 2010


Thanks for the logs Roald.  I put them up here:
http://trac.openlayers.org/wiki/Meetings/06/24/2010

(Not sure if anybody else posted them elsewhere already.)

Tim

On 6/29/10 7:16 PM, Roald de Wit wrote:
>
>     <bartvde>  | hi ahocevar and everyone:-)
>    <elemoine>  | hi everyone
>     <tschaub>  | go 3.0 meeting!
>    <elemoine>  |http://trac.openlayers.org/wiki/three
>             * | strk will be attending meeting, talk about WKT later:)
>     <tschaub>  | rough agenda? 1) additional suggestions not on that wiki page, 2) who wants to champion what, 3) what do we do when
>    <ahocevar>  | +1
>    <elemoine>  | ok
>     <bartvde>  | ok
>     <tschaub>  | I was a bit lofty in the original goals I put on that page
>               | do others have more concrete suggestions that aren't ticketed?
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>    <ahocevar>  | I think handlers should work globally, and not be instantiated for each control.
>               | This will avoid conflicts with multiple controls.
>               | components should be able to subscribe to handler events.
>    <elemoine>  | I agree that this is an issue
>    <ahocevar>  | Similar to tschaub's feature agent.
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>    <elemoine>  | but am not sure how to address that though
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>     <tschaub>  | yeah, I like the idea of the map firing all kinds of map related events
>               | we seldom (if ever) need to register listeners on other elements
>     <bartvde>  | tschaub more like the concept of event delegation?
>     <tschaub>  | and I think we can configure a map event dispatcher for specific stuff like feature related events
>    <ahocevar>  | sounds good.
>         <vmx>  | so a single place to listen to events?
>     <tschaub>  | bartvde: yeah, I think it should be as easy as map.events.on({click: foo})
>     <bartvde>  | right
>               | makes sense
>     <tschaub>  | and people can make other "observables" with the Events constructor
>               | if they wanted to
>               | much as it is now, but with more application events being fired from map.events
>   <juliensam>  | neat
>     <tschaub>  | with click and doubleclick functionality that is now in the click handler
>         <vmx>  | this would make it also easier for external libs to attach their event system to the openlqyers one
>    <elemoine>  | would that address the issue with handlers that Andreas raised?
>             * | tschaub scrolls up
>    <ahocevar>  | yes it would.
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, I think so
>    <ahocevar>  | elemoine: e.g. if you take a control as it is now: it creates handlers.
>     <pgiraud>  | and that would be easier for users to understand
>     <tschaub>  | we want to provide register and registerPriority type control as well
>    <ahocevar>  | instead, in the future it would listen to map events that get fired instead of the handler callbacks that are now used.
>     <tschaub>  | (and decide on which is the default)
>    <elemoine>  | ok
>     <tschaub>  | I'm also very interested in streamlining the drag flow
>               | fewer translations from pixel to map coords
>               | less chatty with the layers
>    <ahocevar>  | very good point.
>     <pgiraud>  | would we gain in performance ?
>    <ahocevar>  | definitely
>     <tschaub>  | well, fewer lines of code to execute is fewer lines
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>     <tschaub>  | another thing we've talked about (that could get tested in 2.10) is OpenLayers.Location
>               | to replace OpenLayers.LonLat
>               | Geometry.Point would extend Location
>               | both would have projection properties
>    <elemoine>  | with information about the projection?
>   <crschmidt>  | crap
>               | did i mess up a time?
>     <tschaub>  | map.setCener(loc) would do the right thing
>             * | crschmidt thought meeting was in a little while :/
>     <bartvde>  | hey chris
>     <pgiraud>  | crschmidt: we just started
>   <juliensam>  | What's the problem with LonLat?
>   <crschmidt>  | juliensam: it's not about lons or lats!
>    <ahocevar>  | juliensam: LonLat can be LatLon (WMS 1.3)
>   <crschmidt>  | it's about xes and yes
>     <tschaub>  | LonLat implies longitude and latitude
>   <juliensam>  | ok thanks
>     <pgiraud>  | many users are lost with this denomination
>   <crschmidt>  | tschaub pointed this out like, 12 hours after we released 2.0
>               | and i said 'fuck'
>     <tschaub>  |:)
>   <crschmidt>  | and we've lived with it ever since:)
>   <juliensam>  |:)
>     <pgiraud>  | it's time to get rid of it
>           <-- | dkobia has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
>   <crschmidt>  | So, the key thing to me
>    <elemoine>  | but do we need Location*and*  Point ?
>   <crschmidt>  | is that I want people to be able to call map.setCenter(location)
>               | and if the map is in a projection, but the Location is in degrees, the map handles it
>               | all this silly 'setCenter(lonlat.transform())' stuff is unfriendly
>     <tschaub>  | elemoine: I think the geometry types make sense - whether we use point for map.setCenter is up for discussion
>               | location could be lighter weight
>    <elemoine>  | tschaub: yep
>     <tschaub>  | in case people want a build without geometry
>               | crschmidt: exactly
>   <juliensam>  | Should img coords be a projection then?
>     <tschaub>  | map.setCenter(loc) handles it
>               | default to wgs84
>     <pgiraud>  | do the Location class know something about the projection ?
>     <tschaub>  | (loc.projection that is)
>    <elemoine>  | pgiraud: yes
>     <tschaub>  | map.setCenter(new OpenLayers.Location(-180, 90))
>    <elemoine>  | and it would make transform more user-friendly as well
>     <tschaub>  | that would work if the map is in another projection
>    <elemoine>  | point.transform(destProj)
>     <bartvde>  | but I assume all geometries will get projection info right?
>     <tschaub>  | right
>   <crschmidt>  | so, another key problem
>     <tschaub>  | map.setProjection?
>   <crschmidt>  | is the whole 'map properties like maxExtent' don't actually have any meaning
>     <tschaub>  | oh yeah
>   <crschmidt>  | the whole base layer disaster
>           <-- | TheDarkIdiotss has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, we could start with methods like map.setProjection
>               | and later add base layer type magic where it fits in
>               | layer groups is the second part of that
>    <ahocevar>  | like e.g. restricting the map extent to that of the base layer
>   <crschmidt>  | so, do we change the map definitions to actually have 'the meaning'?
>     <tschaub>  | if others agree, I think it would be simplest to start with projection&  resolution related properties on the map only
>   <crschmidt>  | (And then have them be changable)?
>               | Okay
>               | I can cope with that
>    <ahocevar>  | +1
>     <bartvde>  | +1
>   <crschmidt>  | It's scary, but that's okay:)
>     <tschaub>  | layers need a way to advertise what they support
>     <pgiraud>  | +1
>     <tschaub>  | so they could be disabled (e.g.)
>    <ahocevar>  | with wmts and more or less mandatory capabilities, we could use a concept of layer capabilities library wide
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, would be good to generalize a set of layer capabilities
>               | we already have many of them
>      <madair>  | the map object needs correct projection and extent always
>    <ahocevar>  | similar to what we now call "layer options"
>     <tschaub>  | and I think we probably all agree it shouldn't take more to create (for example) a wms layer than it does now
>    <ahocevar>  | definitely.
>     <bartvde>  | sure
>    <elemoine>  | do we want to support multiple baselayers with different projections?
>     <bartvde>  | are we keeping the concept of baselayers at all?
>     <tschaub>  | crschmidt: any other biggies - seems like transform and extent/resolution stuff is pretty big
>     <bartvde>  | reprojecting the map should be possible
>    <ahocevar>  | elemoine: I'd prefer to not distinguish between base layers and overlays, but instead provide convenience methods that apply layer capabilities to the map.
>     <tschaub>  | bartvde: I think it could be addressed in a different way (http://trac.openlayers.org/wiki/three/RemoveOverlayBaseLayerDichotomy)
>     <bartvde>  | tschaub: I am all in favour of that proposal!
>     <tschaub>  | being able to say "these four layers are mutually exclusive in terms of visibility" is nice
>               | to me (and I admit this is a limited perspective) the case of toggling layer visibility and having that toggle map projection is of limited use
>               | but I know it is widespread
>               | it could be handled by a "control" or at the application level though
>     <bartvde>  | right that's what elemoine was doing already
>     <tschaub>  | I'm not sure layer.setVisibility should have it all baked in
>             * | pgiraud still isn't used to the fact that a baseLayer options have an higher priority than the map
>    <elemoine>  | bartvde: yes
>   <crschmidt>  | pgiraud: the map options don't have*any*  priority, that's all:)
>     <tschaub>  | pgiraud: me either:)
>             * | pgiraud likes the idea to remove the baseLayer concept
>   <crschmidt>  | but we want to change that
>               | so map projection is everything
>               | geometries know their projections
>     <tschaub>  | map properties rule
>     <pgiraud>  | because it's easier to understand
>   <crschmidt>  | yes
>     <tschaub>  | geometries are smart!
>     <bartvde>  | great
>     <pgiraud>  | ok
>    <elemoine>  | sounds good
>             * | tschaub likes having noble tenets
>    <ahocevar>  |:-)
>               | one thought on multiple symbolizers:
>     <tschaub>  | "you can't render a geometry" served us relatively well for a while
>               | bring on symbolizers
>    <ahocevar>  | right now our renderers set style attributes. instead, a renderer just needs to know the max number of symbolizers, clone the whole svg/vml dom, and all symbologies can be set with css instead of style properties.
>     <tschaub>  | ahocevar: but the css gets generated runtime?
>               | the css proposal I suggested a while ago was about supporting user provided css
>    <ahocevar>  | yeah, that's not cross browser, but possible for all browsers.
>               | tschaub: I know, but I found the concept appealing
>     <tschaub>  | yeah
>   <crschmidt>  | styling features with CSS scares me a lot
>             * | tschaub doesn't know the difference between generating css in the renderer and applying style properties to nodes
>   <crschmidt>  | i have already seen many many users (even smart ones) be completley unable to use Rules/Filters
>           <-- | rkj has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
>   <msavarese>  | newbie with GeoJson questions here.  I have a geojson layer wgs84   on top of a google base map. They don't line up, how do i re-project the geojson layer.
>    <ahocevar>  | crschmidt: you could avoid style objects and set css directly.
>   <crschmidt>  | 'set CSS directly'... on what?
>    <ahocevar>  | and the style object and sld readers could create css runtime.
>     <tschaub>  | afaict, we'd have to parse the css and apply style properties manually
>    <ahocevar>  | crschmidt: on classes that the rendered representations of geometries are configured with
>     <tschaub>  | ahocevar: how about we back up to the symbolizer level
>               | perhaps the css part is an implementation detail to investigate
>               | ?
>     <bartvde>  | people should be able to sue css classes should like externalGraphic
>               | sue=use
>    <ahocevar>  | I was thinking about a 1:1 relationship between css classes on the rendered geometries and symbolizers.
>             * | tschaub loves the idea of supporting user css and doesn't mean to imply otherwise
>    <ahocevar>  | is that what you meant tschaub?
>    <elemoine>  | last post on the mailing list: "i think i have to use Filter.Spatial + Rule + Style
>               | but i can't find the right way to do it!":-)
>     <tschaub>  | elemoine: css is about rules (see stylesheet rules), filters (selectors) and symbolizers (style blocks)
>               | the concept is very well tested
>    <ahocevar>  | I have no big picture of how to implement it yet, but we should investigate it.
>     <tschaub>  | the hurdle is the manual construction of all the required objects
>    <ahocevar>  | I like the idea.
>     <tschaub>  | css is a serialization format
>               | rules, filters, and symbolizers are the objects we deal with
>    <elemoine>  | tschaub: have you said we'd need to parse css and create style objects?
>             * | ahocevar would not think so
>     <tschaub>  | we could provide a css parser that created rules, filters, and symbolizers
>   <crschmidt>  | okay, so this is tarting to make more sense to me, I think: Basically, we could use CSS as the way that users*create*  Style/Filter/Rule objects
>    <ahocevar>  | on the contrary.
>               | if you have css, you don't need style objects at all.
>     <tschaub>  | crschmidt: yes it could be a format we read
>   <crschmidt>  | ahocevar seems to be saying "Styles/Filters/Objects would simply create CSS, and that would apply to the SVG DOM Elements"
>     <tschaub>  | ahocevar: only if we have the same dom structure on all browsers, right?
>   <crschmidt>  | (my answer to that is "What about renderer.canvas")
>               | (Which has no DOM)
>     <tschaub>  | yes, canvas
>               | in any case, it's a bit of an implementation detail
>   <crschmidt>  | yeah
>    <ahocevar>  | good point. same dom structure, and a dom, are required for this approach.
>               | maybe a showstopper.
>     <tschaub>  | if a specific renderer can be made to work, great
>               | the point is we can also parse css and create the objects we need
>   <crschmidt>  | I do think that we should support the following two use cases:
>               |  1. The SLD-style Use case, where users are styling features based on programatic rules
>               | 2. The KML-style use case, where users are specifically styling a feature with a given style
>               |  (KML has many ways of doing it, but think of the way that something like google my maps does it -- where users are generating style data for each feature)
>             * | tschaub thinks the two can be merged
>    <ahocevar>  | which, in the html world, is like css (with selectors) and style properties (on dom elements)
>     <bartvde>  | crschmidt but SLD can also do 2)
>   <crschmidt>  | ahocevar: yes.
>     <tschaub>  | sld is a serialization format
>               | css is a serialization format
>   <crschmidt>  | Anyway, we're getting stuck in the weeds, I'm sorry. I think this probably deserves a longer conversation on the list/ wiki page
>               | But it's not a*core*  problem of 3.0
>               | (It's something we should fix, but not the biggest change needed)
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, I think we all generally see the same thing
>               | make it convenient to style
>   <crschmidt>  | yes
>    <ahocevar>  | agreed
>     <pgiraud>  | make it easy for users
>     <bartvde>  | +1
>     <tschaub>  | but remember, functionality first, convenience second:)
>               | baking convenience in too low will screw us
>   <crschmidt>  | mm
>               | sure.
>               | Okay, so:
>               |  1. Maps are the leaders of all. They have the projetion properties, and you can reproject maps
>               |  2. Layers advertise their ability to render in a projection. If they can't render in one, they turn off or something
>               |  3. LonLat is a shit name. .Location() is the future, and it is smart. Geometry comes from Location, and is also smart.
>     <tschaub>  | (or burst into flames)
>   <crschmidt>  |  4. Baselayers are a crappy concept. Mutually exclusive visibility is the way of the future. Layer groups is a potential name for this type of thing
>     <bartvde>  | Good summary crschmidt
>    <elemoine>  | yep, thanks for that
>     <tschaub>  | reduce the path length of hot code
>    <elemoine>  | tschaub: moveTo?
>     <tschaub>  | sure
>   <crschmidt>  |  5. Things which are called many times (which we now know/can examine) should be miproved performance wide
>               | wise*
>     <bartvde>  | will we be keeping things like getPagePosition, addClass, removeClass etc.?
>     <tschaub>  | 6. pull out as much core stuff as we think might be duplicated elsewhere
>               | and provide adapters given time
>   <crschmidt>  | mm
>     <tschaub>  | crschmidt: it's only an organizational thing
>   <crschmidt>  | I don't want OpenLayers to depend on jQuery/Ext/etc.
>     <tschaub>  | when I say pull out
>               | yes, obviously
>   <crschmidt>  | But if we want to pull out, and create an 'ol-adapter' stuff
>     <tschaub>  | it won't depend on anything
>   <crschmidt>  | that would be the equivilant
>               | that is fine
>     <tschaub>  | but, in the case that you have another lib
>               | we don't make the client download duplicated code
>    <elemoine>  | does it mean we'd keep our own addClass etc. implementations?
>     <tschaub>  | elemoine: yes, we need our own
>   <crschmidt>  | tschaub: Right, I think we're in violent agreement
>     <tschaub>  | but they should be organized in a way that they can be excluded
>     <pgiraud>  | maybe take it from a permissive licensed library ?
>     <tschaub>  | crschmidt: YES!
>   <crschmidt>  | tschaub: So long as you can use OpenLayers in a way that if every other javascript framework on the planet disappeared tomorrow
>               | tschaub: We would be able to just pull things from SVN and have OL still run
>     <tschaub>  | exactly
>           -->  | rduif (~richard at a80-127-244-111.mobile.xs4all.nl) has joined #openlayers
>   <crschmidt>  | that is what matters to me.
>     <tschaub>  | for sure
>   <crschmidt>  | Okay, Great.
>         <vmx>  | +1
>   <crschmidt>  | And I'd love to not have to duplicate that code for people using the Better Frameworks:)
>             * | tschaub feels the same burn from Prototype as others
>     <bartvde>  | and the same applies for the Ajax part? Create adapters?
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, just refactor what we have first
>               | improve it if we can
>    <ahocevar>  | speaking of "pulling out": to keep the library small if customized, we can also pull out geometry operations (geotools/geos like stuff).
>     <tschaub>  | with what we learn from elsewhere
>   <crschmidt>  | some things we can throw away
>     <tschaub>  | ahocevar: yeah, we could have a geom ops "module"
>    <ahocevar>  | tschaub: sounds great.
>     <tschaub>  | that does beg the question
>               | brought up before putting in intersects
>               | about extending geometry
>    <ahocevar>  | that's why I brought it up again:-)
>     <tschaub>  |:)
>         <vmx>  | is there already an idea how those adapters look like? specified function signatures (like interfaces)?
>   <crschmidt>  | vmx: no
>     <tschaub>  | OpenLayers.Element.hasClass just delegates
>               | the adapter decides to where
>     <bartvde>  | right but OpenLayers.Util.PagePosition should come to OpenLayers.Element then
>    <elemoine>  | bartvde: right
>     <tschaub>  | the adapter could provide PagePosition in its entirety
>               | if it was available from elsewhere
>               | casting to OpenLayers.Pixel
>     <bartvde>  | sure that's what I am doing right now but overriding the util function
>     <tschaub>  | right
>     <bartvde>  | what do we with visual stuff, outside of the core library?
>               | or inside?
>     <tschaub>  | well, map viewport is ours
>    <elemoine>  | bartvde: layerswitcher for example?
>     <tschaub>  | all layer containers are in that
>     <bartvde>  | sure but I mean buttons and layerswithcer
>     <tschaub>  | we should provide a nice small set of widgets
>    <elemoine>  | I think it should stay in core
>     <tschaub>  | layerswitcher et al.
>    <elemoine>  | tschaub: right
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, perhaps named differently
>    <elemoine>  | to make it easy to people
>           --- | strk is now known as strk_away
>     <tschaub>  | or named the same - but we should distinguish controls and widgets
>               | wait, that doesn't read well
>               | in any case, I think we agree here too
>   <crschmidt>  | We do need to improve the ability for people to write their own widgety things (which I think we can do, and will do)
>     <tschaub>  | the navigation history control maintains state stack and allows changing state
>               | a set of buttons lets you trigger the control
>   <crschmidt>  | Ideally, we want to make something like GeoExt have almost no openlaeyers interaction code
>               | just some event.register
>               |:)
>             * | elemoine would like to isolate browser dependent code, to be able to use OpenLayers is server-side js environment
>     <tschaub>  | right
>               | ui module
>         <vmx>  | crschmidt: +1
>     <bartvde>  | are we tackling mobile support in 3.0?
>     <tschaub>  | yes!
>               | or at least facilitating it
>             * | tschaub should have qualified that first
>     <bartvde>  | I knew that answer tschaub:)
>   <crschmidt>  | haha
>               | Is there anything hard about mobile now?
>     <tschaub>  | browser event names
>   <crschmidt>  | Like, it seems to me that there are already at least 4 people who have written iPhone touch supporting controls
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, it is awkward though
>   <crschmidt>  | I would assume at least one of them works
>               |:)
>               | Okay
>               | So we'll work to improve that
>     <tschaub>  | would be nice to sub in an environment
>   <crschmidt>  | need more words
>     <tschaub>  | default to the trad browser environment
>               | allow others to easily wire together a custom environment
>   <crschmidt>  | hm
>               | I'm still not getting it
>             * | tschaub wants to browse an OpenLayers map on a melodica
>   <crschmidt>  | But maybe that's okay.
>               | the musical instrument?
>     <tschaub>  | I should be able to swap out the environment with one that wires the native blow event to the pan control
>   <crschmidt>  | Gotcha
>               | But isn't that what a replacement for the NavigationControl does?
>     <tschaub>  | or rather, to the map drag event
>   <crschmidt>  | I mean, the NavControl really isn't that complex
>     <tschaub>  | sorry, then the pandrag control relies on map drag
>   <crschmidt>  | Or is there too much math at a lower level somewhere?
>               | so, it feels to me like the map has the key things you would 'hook up' your melodica buttons to
>               | and the DragPan control just gets thrown away
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, its the native events that I want to wire up
>   <crschmidt>  | I don't think that we can generalize above the level of the map for multiple environments
>    <ahocevar>  | Let's call the connection point between events (blow, touch) and handlers "sensors".
>               | you can configure a handler to use different sensors, depending on the platform.
>   <crschmidt>  | Really?
>    <ahocevar>  | (or something like that)
>           -->  | pwr (d9ab8144 at gateway/web/freenode/ip.217.171.129.68) has joined #openlayers
>   <crschmidt>  | I wouldn't expect them to be similar enough, is all.
>     <tschaub>  | yeah, we need to draw a table
>    <ahocevar>  | maybe, yeah.
>     <tschaub>  | and sit around it
>   <crschmidt>  | But sure, the theory there is fine
>               | yeah
>     <tschaub>  | and then draw a chalkboard
>   <crschmidt>  | hehe
>     <tschaub>  | and then draw on it
>   <crschmidt>  | We have f2f time to work out some of this stuff
>               | so long as we don't use all the f2f time to chalk things out and not write any code:)
>     <tschaub>  | f2f?
>               | ah
>               | yes
>     <bartvde>  | face 2 face
>             * | tschaub thought some new company was dropping bags of money on us
>     <tschaub>  | wishful thinking:)
>             * | ahocevar ducks
>   <crschmidt>  | f2f is clearly c2c plus... 4 or something
>     <bartvde>  | you saw the sencha input of 14 million ?
>   <crschmidt>  | 5? no, 4
>               | SENCHA
>               | sorry
>               | Feeling a bit slaphappy
>     <pgiraud>  | lol
>   <crschmidt>  | Okya, so we have some serious directoins
>               | We also have a*lot*  of things that are minor and easy to fix
>             * | tschaub has a plane to catch
>   <crschmidt>  | removing depracated functions, etc.
>               | do you have 5 minutes?
>               | The questoin I want to ask is: What should we do*right now*  if we have free time that we want to spend on OL 3.0?
>               | Is an SVN branch good? Should we branch to github and all work there for the time being?
>             * | ahocevar is fine with both options
>     <bartvde>  | for me an svn branch would work, I am not even on github  yet:)
>           <-- | rduif has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
>     <tschaub>  | yes, on to agenda item 2.5
>               | yup
>               | fork and delete
>             * | tschaub likes the idea of playing on github
>    <elemoine>  | me too
>             * | vmx would prefer github
>               | tschaub registered the openlayers account
>   <crschmidt>  | bartvde: I'm happy to help teach git
>     <bartvde>  | no problem I'll learn it:)
>   <crschmidt>  | tschaub: Can you fork trunk to git for now in some way?
>             * | pgiraud will be taught git by elemoine
>     <tschaub>  | yes
>   <crschmidt>  | tschaub: and then we can play there?
>               | great
>     <tschaub>  | later tonight at best
>   <crschmidt>  | no problem
>               | not a huge rush
>               | i'm sure none of us have a ton of time
>               | just want to not put everything off until 3 months from now
>             * | tschaub doesn't want the enthusiasm to drop though
>     <tschaub>  | agreed
>     <bartvde>  | do we still think 2.10 will be viable? Who will be release manager of that?
>     <tschaub>  | sorry for appearing to suggest otherwise
>   <crschmidt>  | I'm happy to push out a 2.10
>               | hell, I'm happy to even continue pushing out bugfixes that are submitted going forward
>               | and do 2.10.1, 2.10.2 etc.
>    <elemoine>  | I can be release manager
>   <crschmidt>  | I'm just not going to write all the code for it
>    <elemoine>  | but in august
>   <crschmidt>  | btw, docs.openlayers.org and dev.openlayers.org are both running on an osgeo server now
>               | one that other people can get a login to
>     <bartvde>  | great
>    <elemoine>  | july is mostly vac for me
>     <tschaub>  | anyone want to avoid the bad luck of 2.10 and stick with 2.9.x?
>   <crschmidt>  | heh
>               | i'm not against that
>     <pgiraud>  | maybe something to think about for 3.0 is the auto generated documentation
>   <crschmidt>  | do we pull things like WMTS into 2.9.x?
>     <tschaub>  | we would look cool
>     <bartvde>  | "still amazed by Italy's kick-out of the world cup"
>     <tschaub>  | sure
>     <pgiraud>  | elemoine thinks that it's not really 3.0 relative
>   <crschmidt>  | okay, so .x doesn't just mean 'no new features'
>             * | tschaub is still freaked out by the 91 minute us goal
>       <dwins>  | i have a git-svn clone of OL ready to go if you want. it doesn't have sandboxes though
>    <elemoine>  | I'm not a big fan of adding new features in a point release
>               | why not do 2.10 for that
>     <tschaub>  | oh, just because I'm being silly
>   <crschmidt>  | elemoine: 2.10 is just ugly;)
>     <tschaub>  | I like the idea of 2.8, 2.9, 3.0
>    <elemoine>  | that?
>   <crschmidt>  | look at tilecache: It hit 2.10 and never went any further!
>     <tschaub>  | we look cooler in retrospect
>        <stvn>  | how much work is adding WMTS to 2.*?
>   <crschmidt>  | stvn: It's already in trunk.
>               | It's just a question of what we release it as
>           <-- | friedi (~friedi at pd95bc5db.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has left #openlayers
>     <tschaub>  | additional stuff needs review (and a bit more work)
>        <stvn>  | I'd like to see WMTS in 2.* then and not have to wait for 3.* to get stable (just a user perspective)
>    <elemoine>  | 2.10 looks good too, as the final 2.x release
>        <stvn>  |:)
>     <bartvde>  | sure 2.10 is fine by me
>     <tschaub>  | dwins: sounds good - we don't want the sandbox structure anyway - we'll use git branches
>     <bartvde>  | I am not superstitious;-)
>   <crschmidt>  | Anyway, I'm happy to take back over any release stuff going forward for 2.next+
>     <bartvde>  | call it 2.final:)
>     <tschaub>  | oh, I had an agenda item 3.5 as well
>       <dwins>  | tschaub:http://github.com/geonode/openlayers  - fork away
>   <crschmidt>  | but my method for managing tickets that say 'Review' is "Better luck next time":)
>     <tschaub>  | crschmidt: any quick update on website "infrastructure"?
>               | we can have a different meeting on it
>               | just wanted to get a sense of the current state
>   <crschmidt>  | tschaub: plan is to mvoe everything to osgeo
>     <tschaub>  | website included?
>   <crschmidt>  | We have new fast servers there now
>               | yes
>               | and then anyone can have login access to the server
>               | just need to be added to the group
>     <tschaub>  | sounds good
>   <crschmidt>  | svn, trac, mailing list, and all the sub-sites
>               | sub-sites are*already*  moved
>               | I almost moved ol.org too
>               | but forgot about/pipermail/
>     <tschaub>  | do you need (and could you use) help?
>   <crschmidt>  | nah
>               | i'm in good shape
>     <tschaub>  | ok, my plane is actually boarding now
>   <crschmidt>  | okay
>               | cool, tschaub
>               | thanks for everything
>     <bartvde>  | have a good flight
>     <tschaub>  | I'll catch up on the logs later
>               | good meeting all
>   <crschmidt>  | tell us when we have a git repo:)
>     <tschaub>  | will do
>    <elemoine>  | it's going to be wild
>               |:-)
>           <-- | tschaub has quit (Quit: tschaub)
>   <crschmidt>  | so, I feel like we have a bunch of topics
>               | we have a pretty solid direction
>               | and we have a lot of little tasks that people can help with
>               |  can someone take my points earlier (and followups in the past 20 minutes) and send email to the list?
>               | and then we can spawn threads for contentious topics
>     <bartvde>  | I can try (though Netherlands is playing soon:-)  )
>           <-- | VMESDO has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
>    <elemoine>  | I won't be able to do it today and tomorrow
>               | but I'm happy with bartvde picking it up
>               | s/but/so
>   <juliensam>  | do you include tschaub last  point in that ? : 6. pull out as much core stuff as we think might be duplicated elsewhere
>    <elemoine>  | except it's not pull out
>               | it's the adapter idea, with our own impl
>               | thank all
>               | bye
>     <bartvde>  | thanks
>               | bye


-- 
Tim Schaub
OpenGeo - http://opengeo.org
Expert service straight from the developers.



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