<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Hi<div class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On 25 Nov 2016, at 2:18 PM, Neumann, Andreas <<a href="mailto:a.neumann@carto.net" class="">a.neumann@carto.net</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" class=""><div style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Verdana,Geneva,sans-serif" class=""><p class="">Hi Tim,</p><p class="">On 2016-11-25 12:27, Tim Sutton wrote:</p>
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<div class="">On 25 Nov 2016, at 12:42 PM, Neumann, Andreas <<a class="" href="mailto:a.neumann@carto.net">a.neumann@carto.net</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div class="" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Verdana,Geneva,sans-serif;"><p class="">Hi,</p><p class="">I understand your feelings.</p><p class="">But how can we represent the project if the community never voted on us as being their representatives?</p>
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<div class="" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Verdana,Geneva,sans-serif;"><p class="">At some point you need to bootstrap the whole thing. I don't think it is an option just to continue as before. It is not democratic.</p>
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<div class="">I just want to correct this statement. As far as I know we were all democratically elected. I think we lost some of the records of it on the wiki which we cleaned out, but the original PSC and the second round of member additions we did in 2013 were elected by community votes.</div>
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<div class=""><a class="" href="http://spatialgalaxy.net/2013/08/25/welcome-to-new-qgis-psc-members/">http://spatialgalaxy.net/2013/08/25/welcome-to-new-qgis-psc-members/</a> - in 2013 when new members were added</div>
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<div class="">If I recall correctly (again I would need to go and dig out the records) the original PSC was elected in a similar way.</div>
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<div class="">I think in the case of Andreas as Treasurer this may be the one case where the PSC made an appointment rather than having an election and this was for more pragmatic reasons since its not so easy to vote in a treasurer.</div>
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<div class="">I'd need to go and fact check all the above but really I think we should not portray ourselves as self appointed. What is problematic (and what we are trying to correct in these changes we are discussing) is that we have no terms (still acceptable in some democracies I guess :-P) and so for me the big goal here is to give everyone on the community a chance to serve on the PSC.</div>
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<div class="">Good.</div>
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<div class="">The trade registry will ask me about the establishment of <a href="http://QGIS.ORG" class="">QGIS.ORG</a>. They need documents with minutes how the QGIS PSC and the board have been nominated and elected. That is my main concern here.</div>
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<div class="">In our existing foundation document we only say that the PSC was transformed into the new board of <a href="http://QGIS.ORG" class="">QGIS.ORG</a> - this means that I will have to show the old documents how the original PSC was established. Perhaps, if you could dig up these old documents, it could help.</div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div><br class=""></div><div>Ok I will have a look in the internet archive tonight.</div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Verdana,Geneva,sans-serif" class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class="">
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<div class="">I also think we should not worry - new people in the PSC might bring fresh ideas and enthusiasm and might provide some relief to PSC members who as we have seen in the past year or so are vulnerable to burn out in their roles.</div>
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<div class="">I can live with the clean sweep or the phased approach but my I just think there will be less disruption if we do things in phases than a complete spring clean which will leave many people possibly uncertain of where to start and what to do. </div>
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<div class="">I personally also don't care so much which approach we take.</div>
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<div class="">I am just trying to be correct according to the requirements of how an organization is normally established. They have clear rules in Switzerland (and probably any other country) on how such an association (Verein) is normally created. Just transitioning a former inofficial organization may be quite problematic (esp. if there is no proof/no documents around). That's why I thought a clean election from scratch would help.</div>
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<div class="">Again - I don't think that voting members would replace all of the PSC - it is not in their interest.</div>
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<div class="">Sorry for being a pain here - but it is me who has to deal with this bureaucratic matter and we can't just say - oh give a shit to all this bureaucracy - we don't care. We just work grass root. This is not how you can register an organization in the trade registry.</div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div><br class=""></div><div>No I (we I hope) absolutely don't think you are being a pain - I really appreciate all the time you have put in to get us registered. Bureaucracy is the price we pay to becoming an organisation that can attract substantial donor funding and be legitimate in the eyes of our users and I think once we have got everything set up, the procedural stuff will not be so bad. If your reasons are purely pragmatic (i.e. its a requirement of the Verein registration process) then from me it is not much to debate and I am happy to go along with that scheme. I just had the impression from the former mails in this thread that it was more of a philosophical debate and less of a pragmatic one.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Regards</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Tim</div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Verdana,Geneva,sans-serif" class=""><div class="">
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<span id="cid:DC04A406-570F-438A-B02A-9D05A75EE618@office-linfiniti.com"><KartozaNewLogoThumbnail.jpg></span>_______________________________________________<br class="">Qgis-psc mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:Qgis-psc@lists.osgeo.org" class="">Qgis-psc@lists.osgeo.org</a><br class="">http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/qgis-psc</div></blockquote></div><br class=""><div class="">
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; line-height: normal; text-align: center;" class=""><span>—</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; line-height: normal; 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font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span><span><span><span><img height="118" width="150" apple-inline="yes" id="3DA30228-616D-49A4-ABF9-82E123AC7D14" apple-width="yes" apple-height="yes" src="cid:1A5DF6DE-E302-4C28-BFBD-29663CBF1351" class=""></span><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); min-height: 14px;" class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); min-height: 14px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""><b class="">Tim Sutton</b></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); min-height: 14px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""><b class="">Co-founder:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Kartoza</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""><b class="">Project chair:</b><span style="font-weight: normal;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://QGIS.org" class="">QGIS.org</a></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); min-height: 14px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Visit <a href="http://kartoza.com/" class=""><span style="-webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(71, 135, 255);" class="">http://kartoza.com</span></a> to find out about open source:</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); min-height: 14px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Desktop GIS programming services</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Geospatial web development</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">GIS Training</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Consulting Services</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); min-height: 14px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""><b class="">Skype</b>: timlinux </div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""><b class="">IRC:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>timlinux on #qgis at <a href="http://freenode.net" class="">freenode.net</a></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: center; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: initial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-position: normal; font-variant-numeric: normal; font-variant-alternates: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; margin: 0px; line-height: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Kartoza is a merger between Linfiniti and Afrispatial</div>
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