<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Dear PSC,<div><br></div><div>From the meeting notes [1], it seems the motion for the PSC to absorb the cost (Point 2 in my email) has been accepted.</div><div><br></div><div>Could you clarify:</div><div>1- The PSC is not funding the initial work (Point 1). If so, we'd like to run a crowd-funding campaign. Any promotion from QGIS.org is highly appreciated.</div><div>2- From 3.6 release, the packages generated from the above packaging process will be used under the official download page. This is for our resourcing and crowd-funding purposes, so that we can have everything in place before 3.6 release.</div><div><br></div><div>Kind regards,</div><div>Saber</div><div><br></div><div>[1] <a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TeVmd8W-vJ0NxKmrFybcAV4Sxci50WbNGyZhM5F4bZc/edit">https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TeVmd8W-vJ0NxKmrFybcAV4Sxci50WbNGyZhM5F4bZc/edit</a></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Mon, 3 Dec 2018 at 16:09, Matthias Kuhn <<a href="mailto:matthias@opengis.ch">matthias@opengis.ch</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p>Hi</p>
<p>I once discussed some ideas with Larry to assess the library
version problem with homebrew and packaging.</p>
<p>The simpler idea was to create a system snapshot with a known set
of libraries (or just zip them up?). I am not completely sure
travis allows for launching virtual/container macos instances
inside. This would even make sense for reproducibility on a
dedicated server. Homebrew is terrible in restoring historic
stages in case the build server breaks down.<br>
</p>
<p>The other idea was to come up with an alternative repository for
homebrew that has releases but this will require to build up a
community to maintain this homebrew distribution, but I am quite
sure we are not alone in this situation.</p>
<p>Concerning the certificate, this can be encrypted and stored on
travis. We use this functionality extensively for login
credentials and certificates on a lot of our repositories.</p>
<p>Kind regards</p>
<p>Matthias<br>
</p>
<div class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625moz-cite-prefix">On 12/3/18 2:52 PM, Peter Petrik wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Hi,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>regarding the travis, one concern is that we did not want
to have our apple's certificate publicly accessible Also, with
dedicated server we have some stability in used libraries
(versions). For example when homebrew is used, I think it is
not possible to install specific library version (let say gdal
x.y.z). On travis, you would end up in installation of the
latest version in every build. On dedicated server, you
install dependencies once, you build hundreds of nightly
builds with one set of dependencies and then create package
for LTR/PR with the same set.... </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Kind regards,</div>
<div>Peter</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr">On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 1:52 PM Tim Sutton <<a href="mailto:tim@kartoza.com" target="_blank">tim@kartoza.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div style="overflow-wrap: break-word;">His
Saber<br>
<div><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On 03 Dec 2018, at 14:37, Saber Razmjooei <<a href="mailto:saber.razmjooei@lutraconsulting.co.uk" target="_blank">saber.razmjooei@lutraconsulting.co.uk</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<div dir="ltr"><span id="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265gmail-docs-internal-guid-c2157741-7fff-ab15-1de9-76d3cdf5833b">
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Dear PSC,</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">It the past couple of months we have put together a very basic infrastructure to automatically generate Mac OS packages as a proof of concept and also as a part of a contract with a client.</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">The packaging now works as expected and we will support it for another year. We are aware of the users’ complaints and feedback in regards to Mac OS packages in the past, despite the hard efforts of the QGIS community. Specifically, William who has been undertaking this difficult task. We are also aware of other companies who offer QGIS Mac packages (download links are available after registration).</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">In addition to the lack of any documentation on the packaging process, the packages are not signed by QGIS (or OSGeo), which is not very welcome in large organisations. There have been several emails in the past about this topic but has lead to nowhere.</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Another shortcoming of the current packaging is the lack of master (nightly) builds for Mac users. This has been causing a lot of negative reactions from the users after each release (as they are not able to test the features before the release).</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">We would like to hand-over our QGIS Mac OS packaging to <a href="http://QGIS.org" target="_blank">QGIS.org</a>. This will come with a bit of caveats:</span></div>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">1- The current scripts are not perfect but it is open source and publicly available. We will need to polish it. There will be some additional work to remove a blocker to support older Mac OSes. It is likely to be between 5k-8k euro.</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">2- The server cost (~600 USD/year/server) and Apple Developers certificate cost (99 USD/year) will be probably more significant compared to other OSes. We can start with one server and have the second one if needed. I am sure there are organisations and users who will be interested in funding/sponsoring QGIS with more positive experience for their platform.</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">3- We are happy to help and support the Mac OS packaging for the next couple of years for a smooth integration with the rest of QGIS packages. This will include obtaining QGIS (or OSGeo) Apple developer certificate. Our current packages are signed with Lutra certificate. But the process is easy and documented in our packaging process.</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">4- QGIS 2.18 is not supported. </span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">5- QGIS nightly is also available as a part of our packaging, which allows users to better test QGIS master before the release.</span></div>
<br>
</span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It is really great what you have done - yay! WRT the
certificates, I think OSGEO already has a certificate,
the hard thing II guess is to track it down and get them
to share it with you so you can sign with it.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I wonder gif the packages can be built on travis
which seems to offer a macOS build environment too:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href="https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/reference/osx/" target="_blank">https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/reference/osx/</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I’m expecting negative comments here saying we should
not spend QGIS money on licenses and servers for macOS
but hopefully folks can step back a bit and see that
this is a minimal investment to make a really first
class experience for macOS users. I think we should also
be able to obtain the running costs for macOS through
targeted donations - watching the donations
notifications, it seems that quite a few already
earmarked funds towards macOS….</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Tim</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div dir="ltr"><span id="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265gmail-docs-internal-guid-c2157741-7fff-ab15-1de9-76d3cdf5833b">
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Looking forward to hearing your feedback.</span></div>
<br>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Regards</span></div>
<div style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Saber</span></div>
</span><br class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265gmail-Apple-interchange-newline">
<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Saber Razmjooei<br>
</div>
<div><a href="http://www.lutraconsulting.co.uk/" target="_blank">www.lutraconsulting.co.uk</a><br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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<br class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265Apple-interchange-newline">
<br class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265Apple-interchange-newline">
<br>
</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:center;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;margin:0px;line-height:normal;min-height:14px"><br>
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<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:center;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;margin:0px;line-height:normal"><b>Tim
Sutton</b></div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:center;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;margin:0px;line-height:normal;min-height:14px"><br>
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<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:center;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;margin:0px;line-height:normal"><b>Ex
Project chair:</b><span style="font-weight:normal"><span class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625m_-7250839566885610265Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://QGIS.org" target="_blank">QGIS.org</a></span></div>
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find out about open source:</div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:center;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;margin:0px;line-height:normal;min-height:14px"><br>
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#qgis at <a href="http://freenode.net" target="_blank">freenode.net</a></div>
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<pre class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625moz-quote-pre">_______________________________________________
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<div class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625moz-signature">-- <br>
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<div class="gmail-m_-7824721501419902625moz-signature"> <span style="text-align:left;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;font-size:10pt">Matthias Kuhn</span><br>
<a href="mailto:matthias@opengis.ch" target="_blank"> <span style="text-align:left;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;font-size:8pt">matthias@opengis.ch</span>
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<span style="text-align:left;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;font-size:8pt"><a href="tel:+41764356763" target="_blank">+41 (0)76 435 67 63</a></span><br>
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