<div dir="ltr"><div>Hi,</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2018-06-11 8:30 GMT+02:00 Springfield Harrison <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:stellargps@gmail.com" target="_blank">stellargps@gmail.com</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix">Hello All,<br>
      <br>
      Thanks again for your insights, sorry for the delayed response. 
      Very helpful to get the different perspectives.<br>
      <ol>
        <li>Yes, I understand the need for constant development and
          improvements.  And hence the need for some users to run
          multiple installations for comparative purposes.  I'm not in
          that league so only need something that works reliably.</li>
        <li>Again, I understand the benefits of using a Linix
          installation but at this stage I'm not keen on managing more
          than one operating system.  In this realm, I would be
          considered an advanced amateur or lower-level expert in
          computer management and GIS so taking on major challenges is
          not something I would relish upon waking up each morning.</li>
        <li>Thanks for some clarity on to installation processes.  It
          would seem that for the most utility, osgeo4w would be the
          preferred choice.  It turns out that I had installed 2.8.1 as
          a standalone and am now running it successfully.  It would
          seem unlikely that I should fall back to 2.18?</li>
        <li>Again, mixed signals here regarding versions, some advise
          3.0, others 2.18, while I am succesfully using 2.8.1.  It
          would seem that 3.0 might be a good idea, would there be any
          obvious reason not to migrate?</li></ol></div></div></blockquote><div>3.0 is end of life in 10 days, meaning that while you can still use it (like you do with 2.10), it won't get bug fixes anymore (and few months later, we would fall in the same issue).  3.2 will be released at that moment for 4 months, with new features but also probably new bugs. On the other hand 2.18 is there up to january 2019, had got a lot of fixes since almost two years and much much stable.</div><div>And I still think that migrating from a so old 2.x release to 3.x might not be a good idea but I don't have technical skills to confirm or argument this feeling.</div><div>If your need is to "simply" use QGIS and you don't want to regularly update, I'd say "Just go with LTRs". This is what they are designed for. You'll miss some features but will get them (stabler) once  the new LTR is released.</div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>Harrissou<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"><ol>
        <li>I see that Nicholas makes a good case for osgeo4w.</li>
        <li>Good advice about backing up data, which I generally do but
          not always as frequently as I should.  I do appreciate
          learning experiences but would prefer to choose those which
          are the more satisfying.  With my advancing years and very
          full days, I try to pick experiences which advance my cause
          rather than just overcome bugs.  However, there is always
          value in learning.</li>
        <li>Yes, I do appreciate the community support and find many
          problems are also dealt with in the world of Google.<br>
        </li>
      </ol>
      Thanks again, all thoughts are much appreciated…<span class=""><br>
      <br>
      <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-signature">Cheers . . . . . Spring Harrison<br>
        <br>
        <br>
      </div></span><div><div class="h5">
      On 09-Jun-2018 05:31, Nicolas Cadieux wrote:<br>
    </div></div></div><div><div class="h5">
    <blockquote type="cite">
      
      <div>Hi,</div>
      <div>Answers below</div>
      <div><br>
        Le 9 juin 2018 à 02:06, Springfield Harrison <<a href="mailto:stellargps@gmail.com" target="_blank">stellargps@gmail.com</a>>
        a écrit :<br>
        <br>
      </div>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix">Hello Responders,<br>
            <br>
            Thanks very much for your suggestions and comments.  Very
            helpful.<br>
            <br>
            I must say though that the last few comments have again
            underscored my nervousness about changing anything that
            isn't completely broken.<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <br>
      Ok but are having problems so things are broken.<br>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            Firstly, why are there two installation processes and what
            is the purpose of each?  This implies making a choice after
            learning about the benefits and disadvantages of each.  What
            are the criteria for choosing one over the other?  How long
            is the process of understanding the options?<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      There is the easy install and the OSGEO instal.  The latest will
      give you more choices, like installing many versions or additional
      packages.  You can also simply ask it to install all desktop
      package without having to ask yourself to many questions.  The
      only disadvantage is that it does not really provide a good
      mechanism for  uninstalling Qgis. You sometimes need to do it
      manually when things get complicated.  That is my preferred
      install method.  I think the easier Qgis install has a complete
      remove option usually found in windows.<br>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            Secondly, there seems to be no great consensus over the
            possibility (or not) of conflicts between simultaneous
            installations.  Again, this makes me nervous.<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>According to the Anita Grazer link I sent you, 2 and 3 store
        the settling and plugins in different places.  Anita is my guru.
         If she said it was safe... it is safe!  But I also tried it and
        what she said is correct.  2 and 3 live together and do not
        interact but yes, the problem is real in many cases, just not
        this time.</div>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            Thirdly, why are some operators running two or three
            simultaneous installations?  Does this mean that the latest
            version is not adequate for some tasks?<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Some  installs are  for stable long term support (LTS).  Some
        are under development (DEV). Qgis3,0 is what they call early
        adopters (so it is more likely to have bug but they have all the
        latest bling).  The nightly builds are version containing the
        most resent fixes.  Generally speaking, I go with the LTS at
        work and other versions at home.</div>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            All these things give me pause and discourage me from wading
            in to something that may have a lengthy learning curve and
            an unpredictable outcome.  In this case, the devil you know
            definitely seems to be a worthy rule of thumb.  At least,
            until it fails utterly.<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <br>
      <div>Fix problems when you have time.  Plan for extra time.  
        Backup you data regularly so if shit hits the fan... you have a
        copy of all your files.  This is just common good sense computer
        user practice. Consider the problems you create and solve as a
        learning experience and not an obstacle.  Things get much less
        stressful if you know that you can only loose time and not your
        important data.  </div>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            In that regard, I discovered that at some point I had
            installed 2.8.1 and, remarkably, it would load my ostensibly
            corrupt configuration file.  I appear to be back in
            business.<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      Therefore your Qgis 2.10 is probably at fault and a update will
      more likely give you a more stable environment with better and
      newer features. Remember that opening a Qgis project from a higher
      version to a Lower version can lead to problems so make sure you
      add the Qgis version in the name of the file.<br>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            However, this version still bogs down upon loading the
            various layers but does not fail after the delay.  There are
            about 100 layers, mostly vector.<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Things have probably improved since...  that is why and
        upgrade is justified. </div>
      <br>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            Anyway, not sure if this is particularly helpful but is my
            current thinking on the upgrading process.<br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </blockquote>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      Well we see that this is not easy for you.  I sometimes feel the
      same sitting in front of a Mac where my reflexes are not as sharp
      as with windows.  Again, do it if when you have the time, consider
      this as a learning experience and not an obstacle.  Backup your
      data when doing something you are not sure of and use community
      support.<br>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <div>
          <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-cite-prefix"> <br>
            Thank you all again for your assistance…<br>
            <br>
            <div class="m_120819559299785084moz-signature">Cheers . . . . . Spring Harrison<br>
              <br>
              <br>
              <br>
            </div>
            On 08-Jun-2018 06:25, DelazJ wrote:<br>
          </div>
          <blockquote type="cite">
            <div dir="ltr">
              <div>Hi,</div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Years that I'm using the osgeo4w installer (advanced
                install) with three concurrent releases  minimum (ltr,
                current release, dev, and sometimes ltr-dev) and I can't
                recall on any issue I got due to this situation.</div>
              <div>And afaics there's nothing to be particularly careful
                of, it's just about click click click process and all
                got installed in the c:\osgeo4w64 folder.</div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Just wanted to share my experience.</div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              <div>Regards,</div>
              <div>Harrissou<br>
              </div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
            </div>
            <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
              <div class="gmail_quote">2018-06-08 13:49 GMT+02:00 Philip
                Barlow <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:philipb@pembrokeshirecoast.org.uk" target="_blank">philipb@pembrokeshirecoast.<wbr>org.uk</a>></span>:<br>
                <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                  <div bgcolor="white" link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-GB">
                    <div class="m_120819559299785084m_5968697055809130997WordSection1">
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">AFAIK

                          if you install QGIS with the standalone
                          installer that just puts the application and
                          everything it needs into a folder in program
                          files. You may encounter issues if you
                          installed multiple versions with the osgeo4w
                          installer if you aren’t careful. </span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
                      <div>
                        <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext" lang="EN-US"> Qgis-user [mailto:<a href="mailto:qgis-user-bounces@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">qgis-user-bounces@list<wbr>s.osgeo.org</a>]
                              <b>On Behalf Of </b>Patrick Dunford<br>
                              <b>Sent:</b> 08 June 2018 11:01</span></p>
                          <div>
                            <div class="m_120819559299785084h5"><br>
                              <b>To:</b> qgis-user ML<br>
                              <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Qgis-user] Unable to
                              load project</div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <div class="m_120819559299785084h5">
                          <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          <p>That may be the case for the application.
                            However, depending on the installation,
                            shared libraries may be overwritten when a
                            new installation is carried out and cause
                            older software versions to stop working.</p>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">On 08/06/18 20:11,
                              Philip Barlow wrote:</p>
                          </div>
                          <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I
                                am happily running 2.18.20, 3.0.3 and
                                3.1 (nightly builds) side by side on
                                Windows 10. 2.x and 3.x store their user
                                settings and plugins in different
                                locations so there are no conflicts.</span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Phil</span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
                            <div>
                              <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext" lang="EN-US"> Qgis-user [<a href="mailto:qgis-user-bounces@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">mailto:qgis-user-bounces@list<wbr>s.osgeo.org</a>]
                                    <b>On Behalf Of </b>Patrick Dunford<br>
                                    <b>Sent:</b> 08 June 2018 05:02<br>
                                    <b>To:</b> qgis-user ML<br>
                                    <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Qgis-user]
                                    Unable to load project</span></p>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p>The Windows version of Qgis allows you to
                              run multiple versions on your computer
                              side by side. I personally haven't used
                              the Windows version for several years so I
                              can't be sure if you will have any issues
                              running 3.0 alongside your current
                              version. I run many of the editions I have
                              in virtual machines. If your PC has 8 GB
                              or more of memory, or if you have access
                              to another computer that can run Linux,
                              then you can try it out in a Linux virtual
                              machine or physical computer environment
                              without disturbing your current
                              installation.</p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <div>
                              <p class="MsoNormal">On 08/06/18 07:38,
                                Springfield Harrison wrote:</p>
                            </div>
                            <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                              <p>hello Patrick, thanks for your ideas. I
                                will try the no plugins option.</p>
                              <p>The program will run with no project
                                loaded and it will run older project
                                files but has problems with newer ones
                                for the same project.</p>
                              <p>I can load an older project file and
                                then add newer layers to it and
                                reconfigure them, Etc. This is very
                                tedious but will amount to a recovery.
                                It is better than starting from scratch
                                for sure. But will the same problem
                                reoccur?</p>
                              <p>I have contemplated migrating to
                                version 3 but I'm always leery of
                                upgrades of anything as they often bring
                                problems with them. In this list I
                                notice many references to installation
                                issues and things not running. 2.10 is a
                                devil I know.</p>
                              <p>can I expect any difficulties
                                installing 3.0 +?</p>
                              <p>Cheers . . . . .   Spring<br>
                                Samsung Tab 4</p>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal">On Jun 7, 2018 1:30
                                  AM, "Patrick Dunford" <<a href="mailto:enzedrailmaps@gmail.com" target="_blank">enzedrailmaps@gmail.com</a>>

                                  wrote:</p>
                                <div>
                                  <p>Thre are a number of
                                    troubleshooting steps to try out</p>
                                  <p>1. Start up qgis using the
                                    -noplugins switch or remove all
                                    installed plugins or test removing
                                    one at a time.</p>
                                  <p>2. Backup the config file and start
                                    with a new empty config.</p>
                                  <p>Qgis 2.10 is well out of support,
                                    is there any reason you can't
                                    migrate to 3.0?</p>
                                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                                  <div>
                                    <p class="MsoNormal">On 07/06/18
                                      18:28, Springfield Harrison wrote:</p>
                                  </div>
                                  <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                                    <p>hello Phil,</p>
                                    <p>I did open the project file in
                                      Word, 2033 pages, and found 13
                                      instances referring to the dxf
                                      file. Hard to say if anything was
                                      wrong there, nothing obvious. At
                                      least to me. Some other research I
                                      did indicates that maybe there is
                                      an authentication problem, not
                                      sure just what that boils down to.</p>
                                    <p>I don't think the dxf file is the
                                      problem. I renamed it and bypassed
                                      it on the startup routine which
                                      the program accepted but it still
                                      seized up with a spinning cursor.
                                      Some things still function, such
                                      as modifying the properties of a
                                      layer , Etc. But the screen is
                                      blank and nothing can be saved.</p>
                                    <p>For some time I have noticed that
                                      loading a project file bogs down
                                      for a while and then would resume
                                      to completion. Now it bogs down
                                      and blows up. The key message
                                      seems to be unknown exception.</p>
                                    <p>Some older project files do load
                                      successfully however...</p>
                                    <p>Cheers . . . . .   Spring<br>
                                      Samsung Tab 4</p>
                                    <div>
                                      <p class="MsoNormal">On Jun 6,
                                        2018 11:15 PM, "Phil Wyatt" <<a href="mailto:phil@wyatt-family.com" target="_blank">phil@wyatt-family.com</a>>

                                        wrote:</p>
                                      <div>
                                        <div>
                                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d" lang="EN-AU">Can you open
                                              a copy of the previous
                                              project file in something
                                              like notepad and see if
                                              anything obvious can be
                                              fixed and or removed in
                                              relation to the DXF layer?</span></p>
                                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d" lang="EN-AU"> </span></p>
                                          <div>
                                            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
                                              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext" lang="EN-US">
                                                  Qgis-user [mailto:<a href="mailto:qgis-user-bounces@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">qgis-user-bounces@list<wbr>s.osgeo.org</a>]
                                                  <b>On Behalf Of </b>Springfield

                                                  Harrison<br>
                                                  <b>Sent:</b> Thursday,
                                                  7 June 2018 1:36 PM<br>
                                                  <b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank">qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org</a>
                                                  List<br>
                                                  <b>Subject:</b>
                                                  [Qgis-user] Unable to
                                                  load project</span></p>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU"> </span></p>
                                          <div>
                                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU">Hello All,<br>
                                                <br>
                                                Bad News.  I am unable
                                                to load a project that
                                                normally works with no
                                                problems:</span></p>
                                            <ol start="1" type="1">
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">QGIS
                                                  2.10.1, Windows 7.</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">Project
                                                  starts to load, loads
                                                  many layers . . .</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">halts
                                                  loading "point
                                                  Entity", a DXF file</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">the DXF
                                                  file was renamed to
                                                  trigger the Handle Bad
                                                  Layers service</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">this was
                                                  bypassed but project
                                                  loading still fails to
                                                  complete, cursor
                                                  spinner on constantly</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">exiting
                                                  with Save triggers
                                                  "Unknown Exception"</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">the
                                                  project file is
                                                  trashed to 0kb</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">Exiting
                                                  without Save is OK but
                                                  no project can be
                                                  loaded</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">Restoring
                                                  previous project file
                                                  versions yields the
                                                  same results</span></li>
                                              <li class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-AU">Loading
                                                  some other projects
                                                  works but may have
                                                  cursor spinner</span></li>
                                            </ol>
                                            <p><span lang="EN-AU">Any
                                                ideas what is going on
                                                here?  I have rebooted
                                                the computer.</span></p>
                                            <p><span lang="EN-AU">Thanks
                                                very much . . . .</span></p>
                                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU"> </span></p>
                                            <div>
                                              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU">Cheers .
                                                  . . . . Springfield
                                                  Harrison</span></p>
                                            </div>
                                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU"> </span></p>
                                          </div>
                                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU"> </span></p>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </div>
                                    <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
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                                    </p>
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                                Dim ond y personau hynny yr anfonwyd yr
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                                Os nad y chi yw'r person y bwriadwyd eu
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                                <br>
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                                Ystyrier yr amgylchedd cyn argraffu'r
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