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<p>When any user on your network access the geopackage layer and
(maybe unnecessarily) puts the layer in edit mode, there will be
created 2 extra files in the same directory as the gpkg file
resides in. And QGIS behaves different regarding <i>both</i> read
and write operations when these file are present. This is probably
the explanation of the longer reading times, even if nobody
actually is editing the layer. When the user stops the editing
mode for the layer, the 2 files disappear.</p>
<p>You can check if this is the explanation:</p>
<ol>
<li>Open the gpkg layer in read mode on one computer, check the
access speed of the same layer on <i>another</i> computer. <br>
</li>
<li>Set the layer in edit mode on the first computer, check the
access speed to the layer on the second computer</li>
<li>Revert the edit mode on the first computer, check the access
speed to the layer on the second computer.</li>
</ol>
I am guessing, that situations 1 and 3 are fast, while situation 2
is slow. <br>
<p>First of all: Never, ever try to implement some kind of
multi-user editing on a file based format, where the file resides
on a networked drive. It will never, ever work reliably. At some
point 2 users will try to edit the same layer at the same time and
it will go kaboom (I can read from your mails that you are aware
about this). This goes for - probably - every file based format on
a network drive. <br>
</p>
<p>Secondly: What about making the gpkg file read-only at the
network share level for most of the users. And only granting write
access to the gpkg file for certain users that are instructed in <i>not</i>
setting the layer in edit mode unless it's strictly necessary ? <br>
</p>
<p>The best solution: Install Postgres/PostGIS on your NAS <br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Med venlig hilsen / Best regards
Bo Victor Thomsen</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Den 16-03-2023 kl. 13:49 skrev Árni
Geirsson via QGIS-User:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CALtMHXgi=7_eq=6SjCvSraOdhhLB+dKfFS6nkge6wFFOaFL=-Q@mail.gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="ltr">Thank you for the various responses.
<div>Let me be clear that what I am griping about is not the
locking aspect that would allow multiple users to edit without
conflict. I fully understand that the geopackage is not safe
for that, nor is the shapefile and perhaps also the file
geodatabase. In my case, the likelihood of two people wanting
to edit the same geopackage is negligible, so I take my
chances. My only gripe is the rendering speed of larger
geopackages on a shared network, if they are not set
specifically to read-only. That is not a problem with the
shapefile and I think probably not with a file geodatabase. I
am a long time user of geopackages in a networked environment
and I will continue to use them - they are great - there is
just this problem of rendering speed over a network.<br
clear="all">
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<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, 16 Mar 2023 at 12:33,
Sebastian Gutwein <<a href="mailto:bas@rdgland.com"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">bas@rdgland.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">This is all beyond my expertise but I have
also struggled with the effective use of gpkg’s. In my case
over google drive. </div>
<div dir="auto">Here is what SQLite (the underlying software
for gpkgs) says about using a SQLite database on a network:
<div><a href="https://www.sqlite.org/useovernet.html"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.sqlite.org/useovernet.html</a></div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">I hope that someday someone implements a
system that allows this to work efficiently as gpkgs are
better in many respects than shapefiles. Perhaps Geodiff
could be part of that solution.
<div><a href="https://github.com/MerginMaps/geodiff"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://github.com/MerginMaps/geodiff</a></div>
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<div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Mar 16, 2023 at
8:04 AM Árni Geirsson via QGIS-User <<a
href="mailto:qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Hi Jorge
<div>I understand what you are pointing at and I use
databases such as Postgres/PostGIS also with good
results. The thing is that working with data in
files sometimes has advantages and that is certainly
how shapefiles have been used. The geopackage has
been suggested as a replacement for the shapefile in
the context of regular QGIS usage without any caveat
saying that geopackages only replace the storage and
transfer role of shapefiles and that geopackages
should not be used for editing in a shared
environment, as is perfectly possible with
shapefiles and widely practiced. Not all users have
access to database systems such as Postgres. I'm
just looking for some clarity on best practices for
the common scenario of working with QGIS using file
based data in a network environment.<br clear="all">
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<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, 16 Mar 2023
at 11:47, Jorge Gustavo Rocha via QGIS-User <<a
href="mailto:qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>Hi,</p>
<p>For data storage and manipulation databases are
suitable. Files are not. <br>
</p>
<p>Geopackages are wonderful to transfer data
between systems or to archive an entire project
(snapshot of data, styles and the project
itself).</p>
<p>Regards,</p>
<p>Jorge<br>
</p>
<div>On 16/03/23 11:30, Árni Geirsson via
QGIS-User wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Thank you Jarosław. Isn't it
strange that this was discussed 5 years ago
and SMB file sharing is very common? Would a
linux based NAS be able to use another
protocol? What are my options for file based
data sharing in QGIS? Abandoning geopackages
is not a realistic option for me, but I could
get a different kind of NAS unit, if that
helps, what kind then? What amazes me is how
little I see this discussed. There was a
message in this thread this morning
from Thomas Struller, but I am not sure it is
about the same root problem, maybe Thomas can
elaborate.
<div>Should this perhaps be discussed in
another forum, closer to the development of
geopackage/sqlite?<br clear="all">
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<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, 16
Mar 2023 at 09:52, Sadowski Jarosław <<a
href="mailto:jaroslaw.sadowski@cpk.pl"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">jaroslaw.sadowski@cpk.pl</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div lang="PL">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Long story short:
gpkg is bad idea for network
drives as SMB/NAS etc</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Sources:<br>
</span><a
href="https://www.sqlite.org/wal.html#advantages"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
lang="EN-US">Write-Ahead Logging
(sqlite.org)</span></a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://github.com/r-spatial/sf/issues/628"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
lang="EN-US">writing gpkg and
sqlite on samba shares fails ·
Issue #628 · r-spatial/sf ·
GitHub</span></a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<br>
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<div style="border-style:solid none
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0cm;border-top-color:rgb(225,225,225)">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"> QGIS-User <<a
href="mailto:qgis-user-bounces@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">qgis-user-bounces@lists.osgeo.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Árni
Geirsson via QGIS-User<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March
16, 2023 10:18 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
href="mailto:jhubbslist@att.net"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">jhubbslist@att.net</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
href="mailto:qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re:
[Qgis-user] Geopackage slow on
NAS if not read-only</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div style="border:1pt solid
rgb(156,101,0);padding:2pt"
id="m_-3721556285310908744m_-91705260448882375m_5292080438416008098m_-2869550827560755875m_448025373283784848m_-6768445286251198089footer">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background-color:rgb(255,235,156)"><span
style="color:black">UWAGA: Ta
wiadomość pochodzi spoza CPK Sp.
z o.o. Proszę pomóż zadbać o
bezpieczeństwo naszej
organizacji. </span><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Zastanów
się, zanim otworzysz link lub
załącznik.</span><span
lang="EN-US"></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Yes, as far as I
know, the NAS unit uses SMB as
the file sharing protocol. I
used another NAS from QNAP
before this one, also using
SMB and with the same problem.
I thought pretty much all of
the Linux based NAS units were
using SMB and if that is the
problem, it should be
widespread, but I don't see
any signs of that. Is SMB a
problem for geopackage? </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">I did a quick
test in QGIS: A dataset of
178.000 line features is
rendered in about 1 second
from a read only geopackage.
When I remove the read only
flag, it is rendered in
about 5 seconds.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">If I store the
geopackage on the local hard
drive, the problem
disappears, read-write or
read-only does not matter.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">I have had
suspicions about SMB being
part of the problem but I
don't know enough about file
access deep down in the
operating system to
understand it.<br
clear="all">
</span></p>
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<p
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</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Árni Geirsson</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
</div>
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<p
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lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
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lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">On Thu, 16 Mar
2023 at 01:45, jhubbslist---
via QGIS-User <</span><a
href="mailto:qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
lang="EN-US">qgis-user@lists.osgeo.org</span></a><span
lang="EN-US">> wrote:</span></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border-style:none none
none
solid;border-left-width:1pt;padding:0cm
0cm 0cm 6pt;margin:5pt 0cm 5pt
4.8pt;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204)">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Árni -</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Are you
using SMB/CIFS to access
this NAS, and are you
using wifi or Ethernet
to connect to it?</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">- Jeff </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">On 3/15/23
3:30 PM, Árni Geirsson
via QGIS-User wrote:</span></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Hello all
QGIS and geopackage
users. </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">I store
my geopackages on a
Synology RackStation
NAS unit, like all
other documents that
are kept on a shared
drive in the office.
For larger datasets,
the rendering is
very slow, unless I
open the properties
dialog for the file
in Windows and check
the read only box.
After that, the
features are
rendered blazingly
fast. Nothing else
is changed to see
the dramatic
difference in the
rendering speed.
Luckily, I don't
need to edit many of
the larger datasets,
such as road
networks and
elevation contours
and the geopackage
can be kept read
only. Shapefiles are
not affected.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">What
explains this and
does anyone know how
to solve
the problem? </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Do
other users
experience this?</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US">Árni
Geirsson</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
lang="EN-US"><br>
<br>
</span></p>
<pre style="font-family:monospace"><span style="font-family:monospace" lang="EN-US">_______________________________________________</span></pre>
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<pre cols="72" style="font-family:monospace">--
Jorge Gustavo Rocha
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"Take the open source journey with us"
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-- <br>
<div dir="ltr">Sent from a phone. Amazing! But possibly
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