<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">Well said Marc </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">This has become a fruitless conversation that can have no satisfactory resolution. I don’t hear many voices supporting the view that we need a "course correction"</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Wealth is unevenly distributed. Life is unfair. Open source software can help to rectify that unfairness. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Attending FOSS4Gs helps to build community but does not need to be restricted to the global event. Ravi, if you believe that FOSS4G needs to be more affordable ($200, $100, $50, free?) then I encourage you to step up and run a local or regional event for 3-500 people at those rates.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">BTW I think I am “normal”</div><div class="">
<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; line-height: normal; border-spacing: 0px;">______<br class="">Steven<br class=""><br class=""></span>
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<br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On 21 Oct 2017, at 10:54, Marc Vloemans <<a href="mailto:marcvloemans1@gmail.com" class="">marcvloemans1@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">Dear Ravi,<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">If you feel sidelined, I am very sorry to hear/read this.</div><div class="">Various commentators in this thread have tried in very rational ways to explain how international, regional and local events have different requirements, constraints and even audiences. Obviously, to no avail.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I would suggest that “the prove (or price) of the pudding is in the eating”. If anyone feels sidelined...well, OSGeo is a do-ocracy....so, in stead of continuing this thread-with-no-end-or-single-silver-bullet....I invite you to try your hand at organising a 1000-plus event and see what it takes. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">From present experience as chair of FOSS4G NA 2018 I can relate to all chairs of similar previous events; our growth means success and success (of eg events) comes at a price.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">‘Correction of course’ would ultimately entail downsizing international events, the only time there is this size of gathering our tribes, and even the community at large, which defeats all purposes.</div><div class=""><br class="">About the latter, we do a good job of that.<br class="">For those who have missed it: Paul Ramsey tweeted he left this list..... I have no means to check this, but even the signal itself should tell us all something.....</div><div class=""><br class=""><div class="">Kind regards,<br class=""><div class="">Marc Vloemans</div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div><div class=""><br class="">Op 21 okt. 2017 om 10:58 heeft Ravi Kumar <<a href="mailto:manarajahmundry2015@gmail.com" class="">manarajahmundry2015@gmail.com</a>> het volgende geschreven:<br class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div class="">"the fees are certainly not for normal people from most of the world".. This is balm to all those who consider themselves sidelined.<br class=""></div>Much of the world needs Open Source and Open and Free GIS for Transparent administration among a multitude of reasons. May be it is time for a course correction.<br class=""></div>Ravi<br class=""></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Oct 19, 2017 at 1:06 PM, Jachym Cepicky <span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:jachym.cepicky@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">jachym.cepicky@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr" class="">Guys,<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">the fees are certainly not for normal people from most of the world. Not talking about travel costs.<br class=""><br class="">But, as active member of the community, you can get considerable discount (giving workshops, volunteer at sessions, ...).<br class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">With FOSS4G-Europe, we aim to bring "little FOSS4G" to more people. And it seems to be working.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Just 0.02</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">J</div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="">čt 19. 10. 2017 v 8:44 odesílatel Till Adams <<a href="mailto:till.adams@fossgis.de" target="_blank" class="">till.adams@fossgis.de</a>> napsal:<br class=""></div><div class=""><div class="h5"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" class=""><p class="">Dear list,</p><p class="">I can invite everybody, to follow the RfP process for FOSS4G 2019
[1] - including the questions to the teams. This will show, that
we as CC have the cost factor always in mind. When discussing
about prices, please take into account, that conference fee
normally is 1/3 - 1/5 of the total costs you have when visiting a
FOSS4G.</p><p class="">Also I'd like to invite everybody to make even small donations to
the travel grant programme. We will announce, when the TGP for
2018 is setup.</p><p class="">Cheers, Till<br class="">
</p>
<br class="">
[1] <a class="m_1872694787010356088m_-7745852831520601156moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2019_Bid_Process" target="_blank">https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/<wbr class="">FOSS4G_2019_Bid_Process</a></div><div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" class=""><br class="">
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<div class="m_1872694787010356088m_-7745852831520601156moz-cite-prefix">Am 18.10.2017 um 09:30 schrieb Andrea
Aime:<br class="">
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<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div dir="ltr" class="">
<div class="gmail_extra">
<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 18, 2017 at 8:39 AM,
Bruce Bannerman <span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:bruce.bannerman.osgeo@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">bruce.bannerman.osgeo@gmail.<wbr class="">com</a>></span>
wrote:<br class="">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">When you
look at the costs associated with a person attending a
typical international FOSS4G event, the actual conference
fees a small amount of the actual cost.<br class="">
<br class="">
Consider airfares, transportation, accomodation, meals,
lost wages etc. There is nothing that an LOC can do about
these individual costs.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Ah hem, nothing that the LOC can do once the conference
site is chosen, but something that OSGeo can do when
assigning the location and timing.</div>
<div class="">And I believe that is happening, if I'm not wrong for
the first time the LOC needs to provide expected cost of
airfare and accommodation as part</div>
<div class="">of their proposal, which will make people consider
carefully that aspect too. </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Another aspect that was not cited but that I heard in
conversations and believe is important, it's that it is
really hard to compress</div>
<div class="">the cost of a large conference: the LOC needs a place
that can host 1000 people, and that can give internet to
this many people,</div>
<div class="">that places forces the catering package on you (I've
been told by several conference chairs there no way to
dodge that) and the </div>
<div class="">two together make up for a large amount of the cost.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">So, besides some exceptions (think FOSDEM) it seems the
only way to setup a cheaper conference is to make a
smaller</div>
<div class="">one that can be hosted at a university or in a smaller
conference center. Hence the focus on the local
conferences.</div>
<div class="">I believe the threshold is at around 500 people, larger
than that one is hung on the costly options.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Cheers</div>
<div class="">Andrea</div>
<div class=""><span style="font-family:Arial;white-space:pre-wrap" class="">
</span></div>
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