[GRASS-dev] Wingrass and TclTk

[Benjamin Ducke]

Michael Barton wrote:
> I'd argue for something between these positions.
> 
> I'd stick to just a GRASS installation to keep it simple and relatively
> small. But, I'd really recommend that there is the option of a SINGLE
> installation package for users. Most of the Windows users I deal with are
> intimidated by a package that they download and then find out that they have
> to go somewhere else and install something different just to use the first
> package. 
> 
> So can we include TclTk and Mysys, if needed, in a single package that
> allows all of GRASS to run?

Yes, we can.
I will put together such a "complete" package including these and other
useful things for GRASS that are currently in the add-on repository.
That would also include my own GRASS extensions and r.cva (which finally
seems to run OK on Windows).

We will then have an all-in-one package for novice users and Moritz can
still provide a bare-bones version for people that need or want it lean.

I think this should make everyone happy.

Benjamin

> 
> Michael
> 
> 
> On 10/31/07 8:25 AM, "Moritz Lennert" <mlennert at club.worldonline.be> wrote:
> 
>> On 31/10/07 13:58, Benjamin Ducke wrote:
>>> Glynn Clements wrote:
>>>> Moritz Lennert wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> So, I still believe that:
>>>>>
>>>>> rem Path to the shell command
>>>>> rem set GRASS_SH=c:\msys\1.0\bin\sh.exe
>>>>>
>>>>> is a better solution (since allowing the user to install what they want
>>>>> where they want) than
>>> Yes, but often (especially my type of user), they don't know enough
>>> to want anything (see below).
>>> Anyway, a knowledgeable user can always adjust those vars by hand!
>>>
>>>> Agreed. The above is the only location where a Bourne shell is likely
>>>> to be found. If it's anywhere else, the user will have to set it
>>>> manually.
>>> Or we supply it as part of the WinGRASS binary distribution! (see below)
>>>
>>>> The relative path will only work if grass63.bat is installed in
>>>> c:\msys\1.0, so there's no benefit to using it.
>>> Not quite. With the setup above, GRASS can be installed _anywhere_ on
>>> the file system. The only prerequisite is that grass63.bat sits
>>> in the same folder as the GRASS install dir.
>>> E.g. on my harddisk I have grass63.bat in c:\WinGRASS\
>>> and the GRASS dir (grass-6.3.cvs) in the same folder.
>>>
>>> I then copied C:\msys\1.0\bin, dll and share
>>> (at least the parts that I needed for using the shell) into
>>> c:\WinGRASS.
>>>
>>> This way, I have a completely self-contained GRASS distribution.
>>> I can add more bits an pieces (such as R) easily as needed and
>>> at the end, put everything into on ZIP for distribution.
>>>
>>> I don't know what could be easier. Especially since this approach
>>> does not interfere with an MSYS already installed on the user's
>>> system.
>> But it might install the same programs twice on the machine and probably
>> bloat the grass distribution by quite a lot (don't forget that most
>> people do not have broadband) ...
>>
>> IMO, we should stick to a basic wingrass distribution to which people
>> can add what they want in terms of other programs. If they want access
>> to R, they can add R's bin + lib directories to the path and that's it.
>>
>> If you have a particular audience that needs a series of add-ons and
>> tweaks than you can provide a special package for them, but I prefer to
>> distribute a simple package without any unnecessary additions (and I
>> consider msys an unnecessary addition in this context as there is hardly
>> anything you cannot do without scripts - it just might not be as
>> convienient). Don't assume that everyone has the same needs as you.
>>
>> And up to now feedback has been that installation of the wingrass
>> package is very easy...
>>
>> However, I agree that we could maybe provide more detailled
>> documentation on how to integrate different packages (at least msys).
>>
>> Moritz
>>
>>> The benefit for the user is that only one .bat is visible in
>>> the top dir: it's clear what to click on and there is no
>>> searching in bin grass-6.3.cvs/bin or wherever to find
>>> a startup-script.
>> If the instructions in the readme are not clear enough, please provide
>> suggestions for improvement. Up to now I have not received any feedback
>> from users not being able to find how to launch grass.
>>
>>> Please keep in mind, that my Windows target users will often not
>>> have the ability (or patience) to install MSYS by themselves and set
>>> the appropriate vars in some obscure batch script -- they just
>>> want to click and run GRASS!
>> And so they _can_ with the current distribution, except for the fact
>> that they have to install ActiveTcl if they want the gui (and the fact
>> that the instructions need a reference to how to start grass in text
>> mode). This should be solved by giving the option of downloading a grass
>> package including a free tcl/tk installation.
>>
>> My point above concerning msys being unnecessary is obviously arguable
>> and if there is a general opinion that we should include it, we can (but
>> without any need to change the grass63.bat except for uncommenting the
>> line about where to find sh.exe and another to set the necessary PATH).
>>
>> Moritz
>>
>>
> 
> __________________________________________
> Michael Barton, Professor of Anthropology
> Director of Graduate Studies
> School of Human Evolution & Social Change
> Center for Social Dynamics & Complexity
> Arizona State University
> 
> phone: 480-965-6213
> fax: 480-965-7671
> www: http://www.public.asu.edu/~cmbarton
> 
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Benjamin Ducke, M.A.
Archäoinformatik
(Archaeoinformation Science)
Institut für Ur- und Frühgeschichte
(Inst. of Prehistoric and Historic Archaeology)
Christian-Albrechts-Universität zu Kiel
Johanna-Mestorf-Straße 2-6
D 24098 Kiel
Germany

Tel.: ++49 (0)431 880-3378 / -3379
Fax : ++49 (0)431 880-7300
www.uni-kiel.de/ufg