[Live-demo] Documentation

Thu Mar 11 06:41:01 EST 2010

Juan,
Yes you are right. It seems that some of the .odt files were created 
with correct links and some without.

Feel free to correct the links if you have time.
To check to see if you have made link updates correctly, you can run:
bin/install_main_docs.sh

Juan Lucas Domínguez Rubio wrote:
> Hello,
> In case you didn't know, in RC4 there are lots of bad links like this:
>
> file:///usr/.../live-dvd/docs/http://grass.osgeo.org
>
> instead of 
>
> http://grass.osgeo.org
>
>
> Regards,
> Juan Lucas
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Mon, 3/8/10, Cameron Shorter <cameron.shorter at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>   
>> From: Cameron Shorter <cameron.shorter at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Live-demo] Documentation
>> To: "Hamish" <hamish_b at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: live-demo at lists.osgeo.org
>> Date: Monday, March 8, 2010, 9:50 PM
>> Hamish,
>> Some delayed responses to your thoughts below:
>>
>> Hamish wrote:
>>     
>>> Cameron wrote:
>>>    
>>>       
>>>> However, it seems that the formatting doesn't come
>>>>         
>> out very well.
>>     
>>>> This may need some tweaking.
>>>>      
>>>>         
>>> Abiword is a neat tool*, but formatting issues are
>>>       
>> fundamentally always going to
>>     
>>> be the case unless a structured document format is
>>>       
>> used. Choice of traditional
>>     
>>> word processor isn't going to make any difference.
>>>    
>>>       
>> I agree, we do need to be strict about ensuring that the
>> template we use 
>> focuses on content, not styling, and that styling is
>> applied after content.
>>     
>>> If you want an editor which does the right thing, but
>>>       
>> is still somewhat familiar
>>     
>>> to openoffice/Words users, then LyX is it.
>>>    
>>>       
>> I would love to agree with you, and went as far as writing
>> a document 
>> processing tool for docbook formatted documents 
>> (http://generguide.sf.com) but later conceded that in
>> order to engage 
>> the majority of users, you need to accept that 95% of users
>> use MS Word. 
>> So we need to accept that people will create docs in MS
>> Word, and then 
>> work out a processing chain for creating documentation from
>> MS Word. (I 
>> think we can sometimes move people to Open Office from MS
>> Word, but 
>> moving to LyX is too much of a jump).
>>
>> I should point out that we have huge potential to migrate
>> the greater 
>> community to OSGeo if we can attract Educators to make use
>> of the 
>> LiveDVD. Educators will write training material based upon
>> the LiveDVD 
>> if we make it easy for them, and they are by and large
>> familar and 
>> committed to MS Word.
>>     
>>> [*] tip o'the day: What abiword does for format
>>>       
>> conversions on the command line,
>>     
>>> Inkscape also does for SVG to EPS graphics needs. very
>>>       
>> handy!
>>     
>>> For a flat-ASCII format, upon reflection Mediawiki
>>>       
>> markup will be a better choice
>>     
>>> than reStructured Text (which is nice, but perhaps
>>>       
>> yet-another thing to learn).
>>     
>>>    
>>>       
>> I'm happy to encourage the use of MediaWiki for the
>> development of some 
>> of the docs. In particular, the docs which will primarilly
>> be edited by 
>> geeks.
>>
>> But what might work even better is the use of Google Docs
>> to develop our 
>> word based docs. Advantages are:
>> * Docs can be downloaded as Open Office, Word, HTML or PDF
>> * Docs can be edited online in the familar Word like
>> format
>> * Images can be embedded
>> * Very low technical barrier of entry
>> * Google Docs tracks verion control for us
>> * We don't need to worry about taking up too much disk
>> space
>>
>>     
>>> Asking people to learn Wiki markup should not be so
>>>       
>> great a request**, we could
>>     
>>> primarily use our mediawiki instance as the docs
>>>       
>> home.  Mediawiki allows
>>     
>>> Special:Export which outputs it as simple XML which
>>>       
>> can then be fed to a wide
>>     
>>> assortment of filters to PDF, html, etc. Also, by
>>>       
>> adding "&printable=yes" to the
>>     
>>> wiki page URL you get a "printer friendly" version
>>>       
>> with the side panels etc
>>     
>>> stripped away; so in that way the install_docs.sh
>>>       
>> script could pull the HTML
>>     
>>> version directly from the web. (as has already started
>>>       
>> to happen)  For offline
>>     
>>> users it would be nice to ship copies of the wiki "how
>>>       
>> to install" pages on-disc
>>     
>>> too.
>>>
>>> printer friendly version example:
>>>   http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php?title=Live_GIS_Disc_Quick_Start&printable=yes
>>>
>>> I imagine there are some more simple wiki controls
>>>       
>> lurking which will keep the
>>     
>>> hyperlinks unexpanded, etc., and just show the main
>>>       
>> document frame in pretty-
>>     
>>> form. If not, we could write a HTML page template that
>>>       
>> simply added a header
>>     
>>> and footer and floated a frame containing the
>>>       
>> printable html version mid-page.
>>     
>>> as for mediawiki->PDF, well 178 hits, pick one:
>>>    http://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&search=pdf&go=Go
>>>
>>> this one in particular looks nice:
>>>    http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:PDF_Writer
>>>
>>> example output using Wikipedia's entry for "Solar
>>>       
>> system":
>>     
>>>    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/93/Solar_system_final.pdf
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [**] educators will have at least used wikipedia so it
>>>       
>> shouldn't be that scary
>>     
>>> an interface for them. also as educators IMO they
>>>       
>> should be willing to learn this
>>     
>>> tech so they can teach it/with it. it's not like we'd
>>>       
>> be asking them to use vi. Wiki
>>     
>>> editing is a highly-reusable skill, and also adds to
>>>       
>> our helper pool for the
>>     
>>> administrative wiki side of the project. ;)
>>>
>>>
>>>    
>>>       
>>>> Hamish raised concerns about storing binary files
>>>>         
>> in svn.
>>     
>>>> How serious is this concern.
>>>>      
>>>>         
>>> - once something is checked into SVN, it never leaves.
>>>       
>> So binary files which
>>     
>>> change frequently chew up vast amounts of SVN server
>>>       
>> space even if the trunk
>>     
>>> file is not that big. Even minor typo fixes could mean
>>>       
>> an entire new copy of
>>     
>>> the file needs to be permanently added to the DB. For
>>>       
>> text files AFAIU
>>     
>>> internally it stores version diffs, and branches and
>>>       
>> tag clones are entirely
>>     
>>> virtual. So SVN is highly efficient for text files,
>>>       
>> but a bloated mess for
>>     
>>> binary files.
>>> Currently the .odt files are so tiny that the DB bloat
>>>       
>> factor isn't an issue.
>>     
>>> Once annotated screenshots begin to be added to them
>>>       
>> it gets bad though.
>>     
>>> - using binary files pretty much completely kills any
>>>       
>> efficient peer review,
>>     
>>> which in turn also harms group collaboration. (typos,
>>>       
>> bug fixes, minor updates,
>>     
>>> etc don't flow in from the casual bystanders checking
>>>       
>> out the diffs in svn
>>     
>>> or the trac's timeline)
>>>
>>>
>>>    
>>>       
>>>> I think our primary requirement is that we make
>>>>         
>> documentation writing
>>     
>>>> (which includes images) easy to create, which
>>>>         
>> means we need to move
>>     
>>>> away from using HTML as our source format.
>>>>      
>>>>         
>>> I am all for low barriers to entry, but I don't want
>>>       
>> to believe that <b>
>>     
>>> for bold and <p> for paragraph break is really
>>>       
>> that hard for the average
>>     
>>> voter to pick up. The trick is to just get people to
>>>       
>> try :). IMO fear of
>>     
>>> the unknown is a bigger hurdle than the learning curve
>>>       
>> in this situation.
>>     
>>> ... and of course the world would be a better place if
>>>       
>> everyone went through
>>     
>>> the 15 minute LyX tutorial as it doesn't take long to
>>>       
>> see how amazing it is. :-)
>>     
>>> but for today's vote wrt long-term strategy I'll get
>>>       
>> behind Wikimedia +
>>     
>>> Extension:PDF_Writer and whatever
>>>       
>> &printable=yes+frame, Htmlbook, or simple
>>     
>>> sed script brute-chop method gives us nice HTML. 
>>>
>>>
>>> Hamish
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>        
>>>    
>>>       
>> -- 
>> Cameron Shorter
>> Geospatial Solutions Manager
>> Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050
>> Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254
>>
>> Think Globally, Fix Locally
>> Geospatial Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open
>> Source
>> http://www.lisasoft.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Live-demo mailing list
>> Live-demo at lists.osgeo.org
>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/live-demo
>> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc
>>
>>     
>
>
>       
>   

-- 
Cameron Shorter
Geospatial Systems Architect
Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050
Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254

Think Globally, Fix Locally
Geospatial Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open Source
http://www.lisasoft.com