Foundation and Mapserver MAP file manag e tool

[Doyon, Jean-Francois]

"If we want something "studio-like" for MapServer, we really ought to start
by improving the core infrastructure to provide a better view into the
underlying data sources."

Definitely, though it's not just about data sources ... Flexible access to
symbology and fonts also comes to mind.

"Alternatively, we might see this as a reason not to go down the "approved
studio-like application" road since doing so would require quite a bit of
internal re-engineering."

I see it the other way around, this could be a good motivating factor for
improving mapserver's internal architecture, which in the end benefits every
one, not just the "studio" apps.

"At the risk of raising a hornets nest, I think MapServer Enterprise
provides much more sophisticated (though complicated) views into the
underlying datasources, and other map objects.   While I haven't tried, I
think this makes it much easier to build general purpose front ends to it.
My personal inclination is to keep MapServer relatively simple, even if this
somewhat hobbles fronts ends like MapLab."

Possibly.  I should point out that none of what I said suggests MapServer
should do things it isn't doing, or anything like that.  I still firmly
believe in MapServer doing what it does, and doing it well, and being a good
purpose built solution for mapping.  This however isn't what the issue is so
much as how it goes about it (The internal design), and why (the internal
API's, how they get exposed to the rest of the world, and the
developper/programmer community being looked at as an important target
audience that should also be satisfied, as well as mapping not being limited
to the web).

J.F.

-----Original Message-----
From: fwarmerdam at gmail.com [mailto:fwarmerdam at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Frank
Warmerdam
Sent: December 14, 2005 12:23 PM
To: Doyon, Jean-Francois
Cc: MAPSERVER-USERS at lists.umn.edu
Subject: Re: [UMN_MAPSERVER-USERS] Foundation and Mapserver MAP file manag e
tool

On 12/14/05, Doyon, Jean-Francois <Jean-Francois.Doyon at ccrs.nrcan.gc.ca>
wrote:
> Allow me to elaborate :)
>
> Some examples of things I ran into:
...
> - For the OO thing:  MapServer does not abstract a lot of it's 
> dependencies into consistent interfaces.  So someone who writes code 
> around mapscript needs to do a lot of a various conditional checking 
> and adapt around many possibilities.  Case in point:  Last I checked, 
> I couldn't get a list of attribute names for a given data source from 
> MapServer proper.  I need to know it's a shapefile, use a third party 
> DBF module, and do the work manually.  If the data source is postgis, 
> I need a whole different set of code and exceptions, and so on ... 
> Knowing MapServer itself is already compiled against all these things, 
> I start seriously feeling like I'm re-inventing the wheel, and adding 
> more and more dependencies ... Which is not long-term sustainable.

J.F.

I completely agree.  MapServer only demands enough from the various feature
store types to implement map rendering and simple query support.  On the
raster side things are
even more primitive.   If we want something "studio-like"
for MapServer, we really ought to start by improving the core infrastructure
to provide a better view into the underlying data sources.

Alternatively, we might see this as a reason not to go down the "approved
studio-like application" road since doing so would require quite a bit of
internal re-engineering.

At the risk of raising a hornets nest, I think MapServer Enterprise provides
much more sophisticated (though complicated) views into
the underlying datasources, and other map objects.   While I haven't
tried, I think this makes it much easier to build general purpose
front ends to it.   My personal inclination is to keep MapServer
relatively simple, even if this somewhat hobbles fronts ends like MapLab.

Best regards,
--
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I set the clouds in motion - turn up   | Frank Warmerdam,
warmerdam at pobox.com
light and sound - activate the windows | http://pobox.com/~warmerdam
and watch the world go round - Rush    | Geospatial Programmer for Rent