[Qgis-user] PyQGIS book in the works? Easier to understand online API Documentation?

Tue Oct 15 09:06:22 PDT 2013

But the logical in FOSS is to have a community that learns and helps to
learn. While Linux may be described as someone have cited before, that's
certainly not what Linux really is, because some Linux distros have
customers, have responsabilities to the bottom line, some Linux distros are
pretty popular and globally widespread (maybe not in desktop), some Linux
distros make (a lot of) money, etc.

My point is that Linux is much more than those propositions even when they
may be true, QGIS is similar. On the other hand QGIS 2.0 is a very recent
stable version with lots of changes, as we all know, documentation may take
some time in FOSS when there's not enough human resources. I wish I could
make documentation like this, but I really just can read and  try to
understand python code. I'm needing a good Python for QGIS from scratch
documentation for human beings (kinda Linux for human beings from scratch,
KISS monster).

Anyway, I can't go back to ESRI. Only once in my time working with GIS
(almost 5 years) had access to a license, but I had to use extensions and
it was impossible to keep up with E$$$$RI and found an introductory
training course on FOSS GIS and took it. Still needing pyQGIS and waiting
to be a better contributor.

2013/10/15 Chrest, David <davidc at rti.org>

> Derek,
>
> No not negative at all, I appreciate the feedback and suspected the
> reasoning you explain below. Yes, E$RI (or shall I say E$$$$$RI) definitely
> has mucho dinero to crank out documentation. (Though, they did a horrible
> job when ArcObjects first came out). Yes, writing sure is time consuming! I
> work at a non-profit government research contractor where all work is
> project based, billable hours. They won't exactly let me spend weeks on
> learning QGIS and documenting (though, that would be a dream job!).
>
> I am very impressed with QGIS 2.0 and the documentation that already
> exists. User Guide, Cookbook, The QGIS Training Manual (1.8) book by locate
> press, Gary Sherman's Geospatial Desktop book (it's what got me sucked into
> this OSGIS thing last spring), the searchable email lists, gis
> stackexchange, other tutorials on the web, blogs, etc.
> I just think that an important missing component is PyQGIS documentation,
> but looks like Garry's upcoming book will fill that gap. There was even a
> recent post of a user saying about QgsLabel, "... documentation is missing
> or obscure..."
>
> I like your quote about Linux, but I cannot believe nobody cares about the
> popularity of QGIS and doesn't care about people liking it and it's ease of
> use. Then why all the press? Why did Tim Sutton show the world wide users
> map in his FOSS4GEO presentation? Why the recent comment of a user telling
> us how impressed his audience was after showing off QGIS? Programmers must
> care somewhat about how their creation is being used and what others think
> about it, especially from users who are not programmers, which is the
> category many GIS professionals fall into. So in this case programmers are
> not really creating something just for other programmers to use
> exclusively, they have created something that is used by folks with many
> different backgrounds. The audience of these non-programmer users is there
> by default. Saw that a city's government was going to start using QGIS,
> they are not all programmers. QGIS is seeping into the mainstream and
> programmers must care and be happy to see this me
>  asure of success.
>
> David
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Derek Hohls [mailto:dhohls at csir.co.za]
> Sent: Monday, October 14, 2013 6:16 AM
> To: qgis-user at lists.osgeo.org; Chrest, David
> Subject: Re: [Qgis-user] PyQGIS book in the works? Easier to understand
> online API Documentation?
>
> David
>
> You wrote "(You) just absolutely have to make user-friendly documentation
> about your product, especially the api you keep talking about."
>
> I have been on the mailing lists of numerous open source projects over the
> years, and someone always raises this.  Why?  Well, its true.  However,
> asking and getting are two different things.  A commercial company will
> just hire someone and pay them.  A big company (E$RI) will hire someone
> really good and pay them accordingly. An open source project cannot do so.
>  It only happens if there is someone (or ones) who is  (a)  passionate
> about documentation, (b) knows the system very well and (c) has the spare
> time to write (and writing is very time consuming).  Sadly, this does not
> always happen.  In an open source project the primary goal is to solve Real
> Problems with Real Code; and that goal attracts programmers - who care
> about good code and not "user-friendly documentation" - and not so much
> documenters.
>
> Not wanting to be negative - just hoping to guide your expectations!
>
> Derek
>
> PS If you have the time, there is an interesting article on the
> differences between Linux and Windows (
> http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm); section "Subproblem #3a: There is
> a culture" is of relevance here, as is "Problem #5: The myth of
> user-friendly".  My favourite quote from that article is "Linux is not
> interested in market share. Linux does not have customers. Linux does not
> have shareholders, or a responsibility to the bottom line. Linux was not
> created to make money. Linux does not have the goal of being the most
> popular and widespread OS on the planet."  My personal view is that QGIS is
> in a very similar position...
>
>
> >>> "Chrest, David"  10/12/13 4:19 AM >>>
> Thanks so much for the info Richard.
> Gary's PyQGIS Programmers Guide looks like just what I was talking about.
> Glad to see this book will soon (hopefully) come out. Should be a great and
> fill a much needed void.
>
> No, not being paid by ESRI :-)  I just know that the first thing people
> look for is god documentation about software. That alone can be the
> deciding factor before somebody looses interest or finds it too troublesome
> to work with. Make things so much easier to figure than going on a hunt
> every time you want to do something. Plenty of books out there on other
> free/OS software, especially by PACKT Publishing, would be great to see
> some more QGIS/PyQGIS materials out there (at least 250 pages, not just a
> white paper in disguise as a slender book.)
>
> OK, so the big selling point I keep reading is that one can use python to
> write scripts, automate processes, write plugins, even a nice new python
> console, but there is no api docs for python? That seems very strange!
> Again, looks like Gary's upcoming book may fill the void.
>
> The Introduction in the PyQGIS Cookbook for 2.0 states: "There is a
> complete QGIS API reference that documents the classes from the QGIS
> libraries. Pythonic QGIS API is nearly identical to the API in C++." So I
> click the link but nothing tells me if am looking at the python api or the
> cpp api. Users will not care about the cpp api, we just want to know how to
> do all this cool python stuff. If it becomes a hassle or takes to long to
> figure out (people have clients, budgets, deadlines), then they will get
> turned off and go back to ArcGIS where everything is explained plainly nice
> and neatly. ESRI made a HUGE, monumental mistake when it first released
> ArcObjects with miniscule documentation. Loads of people were fuming. Took
> them 10 years to get things right again and thank goodness they went on the
> python path. A very talented programmer I work with here told me that it is
> well known programmers don't make the best writers. Just absolutely have to
> make user-friendly documentation about
>   your product, especially the api you keep talking about.
>
> David Chrest
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Richard Duivenvoorde [mailto:rdmailings at duif.net]
> Sent: Friday, October 11, 2013 5:00 PM
> To: Chrest, David; qgis-user at lists.osgeo.org
> Subject: Re: [Qgis-user] PyQGIS book in the works? Easier to understand
> online API Documentation?
>
> On 11-10-13 22:34, Chrest, David wrote:
> > Are there plans for a detailed, written in a  you-don't-have-to-be
> > an-experienced-programmer kind of way book that helps explain PyQGIS
> > and how to use it?
>
> I know Gary has plans: http://pyqgis.com/book/availability/
>
> > Python Scripting for ArcGIS by ..
> > Programming ArcGIS 10.1 with Python ..
>
> You are not being paid by them or esri are you ;-)
>
> > friendly. Looks like it is written for someone who knows C++. See
> > http://qgis.org/api/classQgisInterface.html. What in world are Public
>
> You are actually pointing to cpp API interface. Currently we do not have
> separate api docs for python.
> I know Victor has been busy updating the Python cookbook:
> http://www.qgis.org/en/docs/pyqgis_developer_cookbook/index.html
> That should be more informative for beginners?
>
> BUT I also have to point you to the fact that QGIS is a
> community/volunteer driven project, always in need for people wanting to
> make the use of QGIS a better experience. Indeed most of us have a
> programming background, so please join the community as a documentation
> writer (OR pay some experienced doc writers to do it) :-)
>
> Regards,
>
> Richard Duivenvoorde
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-- 
Saludos,

Yasser
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