[OSGeo-Standards] [OSGeo-Discuss] [Ica-osgeo-labs] [TC-Discuss] Open Letter for the need for Open Standards in LiDAR

Mon Apr 20 16:35:57 PDT 2015

IMHO

Colleagues,

Why are we as a community playing catch up on this?

I saw enough interest via the open letter for a group of people and
organisations to collaborate and actually set the agenda and define a
better **open** LIDAR format (assuming that this is required).

Just a thought from an observer...

Bruce

________________________________________
> > From: standards-bounces at lists.osgeo.org [
> standards-bounces at lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Michael Gerlek [
> mpg at flaxen.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, 21 April 2015 1:55 AM
> > To: standards at lists.osgeo.org
> > Cc: Suchith Anand
> > Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Standards] [OSGeo-Discuss] [Ica-osgeo-labs]
> [TC-Discuss]    Open Letter for the need for Open Standards in LiDAR
> >
> > After some of us raised concerns about ESRI’s announcement, they
> clarified that their intended position was as Martin describes.
> >
> > They clearly didn’t (don’t?) understand the *intent* of the Apache
> license and the term “open source". While perfectly legal, it was (and is)
> very misleading of them to use the term “open source” anywhere in that repo…
> >
> >
> >
> > aside: They also say in that repo that “it’s easy and free to convert
> between standard LAS and zLAS”. Until Martin’s new tool came out today, I
> don’t believe that conversion could possibly be considered either "free" or
> "easy” :-(
> >
> > -mpg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Apr 18, 2015, at 9:25 PM, Martin Isenburg <martin.isenburg at gmail.com
> <mailto:martin.isenburg at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > ESRI's github repository contain *no* source code, except a sample *.cpp
> file to show how to use their (Windows-only) binary dll and/or lib files.
> This is *not* open source in any sense of the word but an unusal of the
> Apache license. Below I quote someone whom I've dicussed this with:
> >
> > It is allowed to use Apache License for binary-only software, but that
> is extremely rare that anyone does that, because it goes against the whole
> idea of "Open Source". It is only possible because Apache License is a
> so-called "permissive" license, whereas GPL, CDDL and other "copyleft"
> licenses will not allow such "source-less Open Source" non-sense:
> >
> > See this section of the FAQ on the OSI site (Open Source Initiative):
> > http://opensource.org/faq#non-distribution
> >
> > Also this Apache Foundation FAQ:
> > http://www.apache.org/foundation/license-faq.html#WhatDoesItMEAN
> > "[the Apache license] does not require you to include the source of the
> [..] software itself"
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Martin @rapidlasso
> >
> > On Sat, Apr 18, 2015 at 1:51 PM, Cameron Shorter <
> cameron.shorter at gmail.com<mailto:cameron.shorter at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > Hi Martin,
> > Esri's reference below: https://github.com/Esri/esri-zlas-io-library
> states that the esri-zlas-io-library read/writes Optimized LAS, and is also
> Open Source, under the Apache license.
> >
> > Does this mean that it is possible to reverse engineer the Optimized LAS
> format?
> > Would this open the possibility to integrate LASzip and Optimized LAS?
> > Thoughts?
> >
> > Regards Cameron.
> >
> > On 17/04/2015 6:52 pm, Suchith Anand wrote:
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I would like to invite inputs from the geocommunity so I can include all
> concerns of the wider geospatial community in my email response . Please do
> email your inputs to me before 25th April 2015 for this.
> >
> > If you have not yet signed the letter at
> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/LIDAR_Format_Letter   may I  request that all
> who wish to support this effort to protect Open Standards for Geospatial
> data to kindly add your name , email, affiliation details to the wikipage
> directly or email  Patrick Hogan (Email - patrick.hogan at nasa.gov<mailto:
> patrick.hogan at nasa.gov> ) with the subject heading "Support for Open Geo
> Standards" and the following fields (Name, Email, Affiliation ) and we will
> gladly add this to the wiki.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> >
> > Suchith
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: TC-Discuss [tc-discuss-bounces at lists.opengeospatial.org<mailto:
> tc-discuss-bounces at lists.opengeospatial.org>] On Behalf Of Keith Ryden [
> kryden at esri.com<mailto:kryden at esri.com>]
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2015 7:54 PM
> > To: tc-discuss at lists.opengeospatial.org<mailto:
> tc-discuss at lists.opengeospatial.org>
> > Subject: Re: [TC-Discuss] Open Letter for the need for Open Standards in
> LiDAR
> >
> > Regarding Dr. Anand’s concerns and the referenced letter below:
> >
> > Esri has long understood the importance of interoperability between
> systems and users of geographic information and services. Esri has
> participated in the development of national, information community, OGC,
> and ISO TC 211 standards from the development of the US Spatial Data
> Transfer Standard in the 1980s through the development of OGC Geopackage
> today. As a sustaining member of ASPRS and a Principle member of OGC, Esri
> would gladly participate in efforts to further the development of open
> LIDAR and point cloud standards. Keep in mind that ASPRS owns and maintains
> LAS, along with other spatial information standards, and would have the
> lead in moving it into  OGC or ISO TC211 for further work if they so
> desired. Esri will continue to support and use the ASPRS LAS standard; the
> Optimized LAS (see FAQ at https://github.com/Esri/esri-zlas-io-library)
> is not intended to replace LAS but to enhance access to remotely stored
> LIDAR information for our users.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Keith Ryden
> > ESRI Software Development
> >
> > From: TC-Discuss [mailto:tc-discuss-bounces+kryden=
> esri.com at lists.opengeospatial.org] On Behalf Of Suchith Anand
> > Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 10:30 AM
> > To: discuss at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:discuss at lists.osgeo.org>;
> ica-osgeo-labs at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:ica-osgeo-labs at lists.osgeo.org>;
> tc-discuss at lists.opengeospatial.org<mailto:
> tc-discuss at lists.opengeospatial.org>
> > Subject: [TC-Discuss] Open Letter for the need for Open Standards in
> LiDAR
> >
> > To all colleagues in Academia, Government and Industry who have interest
> in maintaining Open Standards:
> >
> >
> > On behalf of "Geo for All" community, http://www.geoforall.org<
> http://www.geoforall.org/>, I would like to bring to your kind attention
> a significant development that can lead to undermining our principle for
> Open Geospatial Standards. I request you review the wikipage
> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/LIDAR_Format_Letter   that is meant to
> represent our concern and allow for ongoing input and expression by our
> geospatial community.
> >
> > We specifically thank Martin Isenburg (author of LASzip and LAStools,
> http://laszip.org<http://laszip.org/> and http://lastools.org<
> http://lastools.org/>) for  bringing this matter to our attention (email
> below) and an email thread of our initial discussion of this subject that
> highlight the wider implication of this issue
> http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/ica-osgeo-labs/2015-March/001225.html
> > We request all who wish to support this effort to protect Open Standards
> for Geospatial data to kindly add your name , email, affiliation details to
> the wikipage directly or email  Patrick Hogan (Email -
> patrick.hogan at nasa.gov<mailto:patrick.hogan at nasa.gov> ) with the subject
> heading "Support for Open Geo Standards" and the following fields (Name,
> Email, Affiliation ) and we will gladly add this to the wiki.
> >
> > There is current interest by the OGC in pursuing point cloud encoding
> standards, including a member-initiated mechanism to extend LAS data with
> OGC-standard XML content. The OGC invites interested members who wish to
> work on this effort to please contact Scott Simmons (Executive Director,
> Standards Program  E-mail : ssimmons at opengeospatial.org<mailto:
> ssimmons at opengeospatial.org>  ) to register their interest and discuss
> details.  OGC will also be holding an ad hoc session at our next Technical
> Committee meeting in Boulder, CO, USA in June 1st (more details will be
> send soon) to bring together all interested from all sectors (government,
> industry, academia) for this and plan next steps. We welcome feedback and
> input from Esri and invite them to join this effort to  support open LIDAR
> formats.
> >
> > I thank you all again for your attention and support for this important
> matter.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> >
> > Suchith Anand
> > Founder, GeoForAll
> > http://www.geoforall.org<http://www.geoforall.org/>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------- Forwarded Message --------
> > Subject:
> >
> > Please review: Open Letter asking to avoid format fragmentation in LiDAR
> standards
> >
> > Date:
> >
> > Sat, 11 Apr 2015 12:14:51 +1000
> >
> > From:
> >
> > Cameron Shorter <cameron.shorter at gmail.com><mailto:
> cameron.shorter at gmail.com>
> >
> > To:
> >
> > standards at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:standards at lists.osgeo.org> <
> standards at lists.osgeo.org><mailto:standards at lists.osgeo.org>
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi all,
> > A number of us have been collaboratively developing an Open Letter
> asking key stakeholders to avoid fragmentation in LiDAR standards.
> >
> > It starts:
> > We, the undersigned, are concerned that the current interoperability
> between LiDAR applications, through use of the open "LAS" format, is being
> threatened by ESRI's introduction and promotion of an alternative
> "Optimized LAS" proprietary format. This is of concern since the
> fragmentation of the LAS format will lead to reduced interoperability
> between applications and organisations, and introduce vendor lock-in.
> >
> > Could all interested please:
> > 1. Review and provide feedback to this standards email list
> > 2. If you agree with the letter, please add your name to the "Signed"
> section
> >
> > --
> >
> > Cameron Shorter,
> >
> > Software and Data Solutions Manager
> >
> > LISAsoft
> >
> > Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
> >
> > 26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009
> >
> >
> >
> > P +61 2 9009 5000<tel:%2B61%202%209009%205000>,  W www.lisasoft.com<
> http://www.lisasoft.com/>,  F +61 2 9009 5099<tel:%2B61%202%209009%205099>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
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> >
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> >
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> > University of Nottingham.
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> > This message has been checked for viruses but the contents of an
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> > computer system, you are advised to perform your own checks. Email
> > communications with the University of Nottingham may be monitored as
> > permitted by UK legislation.
> >
> >
> > This message and any attachment are intended solely for the addressee
> > and may contain confidential information. If you have received this
> > message in error, please send it back to me, and immediately delete it.
> >
> > Please do not use, copy or disclose the information contained in this
> > message or in any attachment.  Any views or opinions expressed by the
> > author of this email do not necessarily reflect the views of the
> > University of Nottingham.
> >
> > This message has been checked for viruses but the contents of an
> > attachment may still contain software viruses which could damage your
> > computer system, you are advised to perform your own checks. Email
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Discuss mailing list
> > Discuss at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:Discuss at lists.osgeo.org>
> > http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >
> >
> > --
> > Cameron Shorter,
> > Software and Data Solutions Manager
> > LISAsoft
> > Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
> > 26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009
> >
> > P +61 2 9009 5000<tel:%2B61%202%209009%205000>,  W www.lisasoft.com<
> http://www.lisasoft.com/>,  F +61 2 9009 5099<tel:%2B61%202%209009%205099>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Standards at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:Standards at lists.osgeo.org>
> > http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/standards
> >
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