[Board] Mapworld Forum 2011

[Arnulf Christl (OSGeo)]

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Ravi,
I completely agree with Frank. How can we proceed from here now? I need
some more information to understand where you come from. If you prefer
we can have a phone call or conference call. Please let me know.

In general we will want to make sure that this kind of thing does not
happen again so let me also ask how we can improve our processes. Could
we have advertized this type of question better beforehand? The logs of
the corresponding Board Meeting [1] suggest that you attended. That
meeting would have been the best place to discuss before actually
committing to something. In the meeting we agreed to proceed being an
Institutional Partner, changing this now would need more thorough arguing.

Maybe we can have a dialog on your issues to better understand where
each of us come from. I will further comment inline.

Frank Warmerdam wrote:
> Ravi wrote:
>> Dear OSGeo Board,
>> Sub: Participation of OSGeo  at Mapworld Forum  January 2011, at
>> Hyderabad.
>> Ref: Mapworld Forum January 2011 Hyderabad.
>>
>> The Executive council (E.C) of OSGeo India wish to convey the
>> following to the OSGeo's board.
>>
>>  The E.C learned that one of the Director's of  (OSGeo), Arnulf
>> Christl may attend the Map World Forum January 2011.
>>  OSGeo India is not going to participate in the 'Map World Forum
>> 2011', in spite of the fact that there is a good support for
>>  OSGeo activities, in the city of Hyderabad and a premier educational
>> institute namely IIIT, Hyderabad is the seat of OSGeo India.

To me first off this sounds like a great chance. But I also completely
agree with Frank that OSGeo India can avoid investing resources in the
Map World Forum event.

>> Reasons for non participation in Mapworld Forum January 2011:
>>     1. We see the event 'Mapworld Forum', a facade to show case
>> Proprietary GIS Solutions, and
>>    promote their market in India, which is counter productive to
>> spread of Free and Open Souce GIS.

Quite contrarily I would suggest that this is a perfect chance to
highlight the advantages of Open Source. I fail to understand why this
would be counter productive? Can you please explain?

>>    The organisers only wish to have the much needed advantage, which
>> they will gain for sure, through
>>    OSGeo (International) accepting to partner.

We might want to ask the organizer directly instead of speculating on
their wishes. If you prefer we can also do this privately.

>> 2. 'GIS Development', which conducts the event, has done precious
>> little to support OSGeo and Open Source GIS
>>    since January, 2007, when OSGeo India was launched. The organisers
>> have an educational institute which only
>>    propagates Proprietary GIS. 

Unfortunately this is still true for most training providers. There are
very few educational institutes who offer geospatial Open Source
software trainings. In Germany for example we are lucky to have several
private companies and some universities who also offer training for Open
Source but even here the majority of trainings focuses exclusively on
proprietary software.

>> To encourage use and teaching of Open
>> Source GIS, OSGeo India resource persons attended
>>    events conducted by them free of charge, but in vain. OSGeo India
>> has even contributed by way scientific articles in
>>    their journal, following their request.

What does "in vain" mean here? If you are frustrated that progress is
slow in changing people's minds then feel welcome in the club. It takes
a lot of time and patience to invoke changes of this dimension.

>> 3. Though the organisers are very much in touch with OSGeo India
>> office bearers, they have not communicated with
>>    OSGeo India.

What does this exactly mean? Maybe it was wrong for me to answer the
reques tin the first place and shold have forwarded it to OSGeo India. I
apologize if that was the problem, to me WMF looks like a rather
international event. If you wish to communicate with  GIS-Development
directly you are more than welcome.

You might also want to check the website link https://osgeo.in/ as
advertized on the OSGeo India Wiki page [1]. It currently onyl returns
the the default "Apache is working on your cPanel® and WHM™ Server" page.

>> 4. The event Mapworld Forum, is a very costly event with a very high
>> registration fee structure
>>    which does not encourage serious participation by Open Source GIS
>> users and developers alike.

I can completely understand that it will be difficult for a great many
people to attend WMF. On the other hand this is a great chance to reach
out to a group of potential Open Source users who appear to have funding
to afford such an expensive event. This might also mean that they have
money to spend on services instead of licenses. These services can be
provided by local businesses in India who support and use OSGeo software
but if OSGeo India does not appear at the WMF nobody will know of this
potential. So again I can see a chance in attending, not an issue.

>> 5. We request the OSGeo (International) to avoid partnering /
>> attending this event, as the absence of OSGeo India, in an event
>>    chaired by the OSGeo (International) will not set a good example,
>> that too when most of active OSGeo India executive
>>    resides in the same city, Hyderabad, where the event is going to be
>> held.

This is a major change in policy and I suggest that you add this to the
agenda for the next board meeting if we cannot resolve it positively.

Best regards,
Arnulf.

> Ravi,
> 
> I have struggled with this request and not come to a firm conclusion as to
> what I think the right path is.  On the one hand, I'd like to respect
> OSGeo India's opinion on your own turf.  On the other hand I generally
> do not
> like to discourage the involvement of OSGeo advocates in any event or
> venue.
> In particular, I don't like to try and draw a line down the middle of the
> geospatial world with proprietary on one side, and open source on the other
> and to discourage fraternization over that line.
> 
> We (OSGeo) have generally taken the position that it is good for our
> mission
> to reach out organizations that have been traditionally quite proprietary
> in nature.  This manifests, for instance, in encouraging the participation
> of proprietary software companies in FOSS4G with however an expectation
> that presentations or workshops have at least some open source connection.
> We also encourage bridges between open source and proprietary software
> packages.  In my realm (GDAL) this manifests as putting effort into
> supporting
> translation services for the internal formats of proprietary software
> packages.
> 
> I completely respect OSGeo India's right to avoid investing resources in
> the Mapworld Forum event if you don't feel it is a good way to reach the
> desired user base.  I'd be willing to consider whether or not it is
> appropriate for us to appear as a "partner" in Mapworld Forum.  But I
> think it would be inappropriate to discourage OSGeo advocates from
> speaking there.
> 
> By the way, I have generally found the GIS Development folks to be pretty
> open to open source activities.  I was invited to act in an advisory role
> with them one year, though I'm afraid I was essentially a dud in that
> role.  I don't doubt they lean towards supporting their advertisers which
> mostly means proprietary GIS companies, but I have not found them
> exclusionary.  I feel engagement is worthwhile.
> 
> Best regards,

[1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Meeting_2010-04-08#Minutes

- --
Arnulf Christl
President OSGeo
http://www.osgeo.org
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