[OSGeo-Discuss] Enterprise OSDB for OSGIS

Chris Holmes cholmes at openplans.org
Mon Dec 11 18:21:55 PST 2006

Do you have any good links to documents on hints for tuning PostGIS?  Or 
maybe a wiki page where people can continue to add suggestions for tuning?

Paul Ramsey wrote:
> Best be VERRRRRY careful about doing the best tuning possible when 
> carrying out these tests, or the results you get back could be 
> meaningless.  Different workloads with bad / good tunings can yield 
> order-of-magnitude differences in performance.
> P
> On 11-Dec-06, at 5:41 PM, <chenrg at lreis.ac.cn> <chenrg at lreis.ac.cn> wrote:
>> Thank you very much, Frank,
>> PostGIS is very promising. We've tested it with ArcSDE and Oracle 
>> Spatial. Its spatial query performance is equivalent to ArcSDE, and 
>> much better than Oracle Spatial. Its spatial processing (such as 
>> intersection, union) performance is better than Oracle Spatial, but 
>> has a big gap comparing to ArcSDE due to the GEOS's poor performance 
>> (The test showed that GRASS is very good at spatial processing).  
>> We're considering to propose a new benchmark for spatial DBMS (The 
>> Sequoia 2000 and Paradise benchmark are quite old ones). The 
>> effectiveness of the benchmark will be demonstrated using a variety of 
>> spatial queries over a 10-100GB spatial data in five example DBMSs 
>> including the commercial ones such as Oracle Spatial, IBM DB2 Spatial 
>> extender and ESRI ArcSDE and the open source ones such as 
>> PostGIS/PostgreSQL and MySQL Spatial extensions. And we have plan to 
>> do some DBMS benchmark (TPC-C and AS3AP) tests. The targets will be 
>> Oracle, Ingres, PostgreSQL, MySQL, MaxDB and Firebird in Linux. The 
>> tools'll include Benchmark Factory for Databases from 
>> Quest(www.quest.com) and the ODBC Driver from OpenLink 
>> (www.openlinksw.com). If PostgreSQL + PostGIS performs well, we'll 
>> carry through our GRIDGIS project based on it.
>> Best regards,
>> Chen
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Frank Warmerdam" <warmerdam at pobox.com>
>> To: <discuss at mail.osgeo.org>
>> Cc: <chenrg at lreis.ac.cn>
>> Sent: Monday, December 11, 2006 11:26 PM
>> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Enterprise OSDB for OSGIS
>>> chenrg at lreis.ac.cn wrote:
>>>> Dear all,
>>>> There are many comparisons about OSDBs, such as:
>>>> http://www.geocities.com/mailsoftware42/db/
>>>> http://www.fabalabs.org/research/papers/FabalabsResearchPaper-OSDBMS-Eval.pdf 
>>>> http://www.virtuas.com/files/osl-osrdb-01.pdf
>>>> http://www.osdbmigration.org:8080/osdb/osdb-features
>>>> I'm not sure which will be the most promising enterprise OSDB for 
>>>> OSGIS.
>>>> (1) PostGIS is an excellent one, but its performance depends on 
>>>> PostgreSQL;
>>>> (2) MySQL Spatial Extension (MyGIS) faces the same problem.
>>>> Another solution is to build a Spatial Data Engine (like ArcSDE) for
>>>> FireBird or MaxDB or Ingres.
>>>> Checked the source codes of several OSDB:
>>> ...
>>>> It seems that Ingres is more powerful and has more enterprise 
>>>> functions.
>>>> Further more, it has internal support for spatial extension.
>>>> Is it a reasonable solution to choose it to build enterprise OSGIS? Any
>>>> advice and suggestions?
>>> Prof. Chen,
>>> I reviewed the helpful document you referenced at:
>>>   http://www.osdbmigration.org:8080/osdb/osdb-features
>>> And from this it did not seem clear that Ingres was substantially more
>>> powerful than PostgreSQL.  In that matrix it seems that PostgreSQL
>>> compared fairly well on the various enterprise features listed.  I'm
>>> afraid I did not have time to review all the other documents.
>>> You mention that PostGIS is excellent, but that its performance
>>> depends on PostgreSQL.  Is that a problem?  It has been my (limited)
>>> experience that a well tuned postgres performs well compared to other
>>> enterprise class commercial databases, though it sometimes performs
>>> less well than very performance focused databases like MySQL.
>>> MySQL is a promising player in the geospatial osdb space, and I was
>>> pleased to see their addition of limited OGC simple features support.
>>> But, in my opinion, MySQL is a stretch to refer to as "enterprise
>>> class" in the terms the document above lists.  Also, it's spatial
>>> support is quite limited by comparison to PostGIS.
>>> I am not really familiar with the other databases listed.
>>> My main point though is that usefulness and success in the open source
>>> community is in significant part about the healthiness of the ecosystem
>>> around a project.  That is, the number of users and contributors and the
>>> number of people knowledgeable about the product.  Also, the helpfulness
>>> of on line resources such as mailing lists, irc channels, and web sites.
>>> On that basis it seems to me that the only spatial open source database
>>> with any significant mind-share and community is PostgreSQL+PostGIS.  I
>>> am speaking from the spatial point of view of course.  I'm sure all the
>>> databases have substantial users bases.  In the case of MySQL it also
>>> has a substantial number of users in the geospatial space, though few
>>> of those users are actually using the spatial extensions to mysql
>>> (in my experience).
>>> So, if I were wanting to build out an enterprise class open source
>>> spatial database system for an enterprise, I think I would start
>>> by looking at PostgreSQL + PostGIS and only look further if I found
>>> substantial inadequacies for my needs.
>>> Best regards,
>>> -----------------------------------------+-------------------------------------- 
>>> I set the clouds in motion - turn up   | Frank Warmerdam, 
>>> warmerdam at pobox.com
>>> light and sound - activate the windows | http://pobox.com/~warmerdam
>>> and watch the world go round - Rush    | President OSGeo, 
>>> http://osgeo.org
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Chris Holmes
The Open Planning Project
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