[Qgis-community-team] How do I do that on QGIS?

[Ramon Andinach]

On 29/03/2011, at 16:07 , Alister Hood wrote:

> Hi again,
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: qgis-community-team-bounces at lists.osgeo.org [mailto:qgis-
>> community-team-bounces at lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of custard
>> Sent: Tuesday, 22 March 2011 3:55 p.m.
>> To: Qgis-community-team at lists.osgeo.org
>> Subject: Re: [Qgis-community-team] How do I do that on QGIS?
>> 
>> Hi Alister,
>> 
>> ----- "Alister Hood" <alister.hood at synergine.com> wrote:
>>> Hi Ramon,
>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: qgis-community-team-bounces at lists.osgeo.org
>>> [mailto:qgis-community-team-
>>>> bounces at lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Ramon Andinach
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, 22 March 2011 12:20 a.m.
>>>> To: Qgis-community-team at lists.osgeo.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [Qgis-community-team] How do I do that on QGIS?
>>>> 
>>>> Right here goes.
>>>> 
>>>> The "How do I do that in QGIS?" is now up on the wiki.
>>>> 
>>>> It can be reached from the Users Corner, in the HowTos section
>>>> (http://www.qgis.org/wiki/Users_Corner#HowTos).
>>>> 
>>>> It can be reached directly here:
>>>> http://www.qgis.org/wiki/How_do_I_do_that_in_QGIS
>>>> 
>>>> My intention was to keep it as a direct section for section
>>> equivalent
>>> for the
>>>> "How do I do that in ArcGIS/Manifold?" document, but I can see a
>>> suggestion,
>>>> and it's a good one, so maybe we shouldn't feel constrained by
>> that
>>> too much.
>>>> Thoughts?
>>> 
>>> Personally I think it would be good to keep the structure in line
>>> with the
>>> ArcGIS/Manifold document so that they can be compared easily.  As
>>> well as
>>> potentially helping users coming from or going to ArcGIS or
>> Manifold,
>>> this could allow users to easily identify:
>>> 1) "classic GIS tasks" that aren't yet included in "How do I do that
>>> in QGIS?", so they can write them up.  (let's build on the work that
>> has
>>> already been done by others, instead of trying to come up with a new
>> list of
>>> essential GIS tasks)
>>> 2) functionality that is available in ArcGIS or Manifold but not
>>> (yet)
>>> in
>>> QGIS.  (e.g. for the "sorting tabular data" task, it is not
>> currently
>>> possible in QGIS to sort by multiple columns)
>> 
>> I'm glad you say that - it means I didn't miss something obvious.
>> 
>>> Even if the structure is kept in line with the ArcGIS/Manifold
>>> document, we
>>> can still add additional tasks.  I'd suggest restricting it to
>>> similar "classic GIS tasks", rather than including tutorials for
>>> anything and everything - those would be better in a separate list.
>>> If you'd like, I can add a short paragraph defining "classic GIS
>>> tasks" and
>>> explaining the history of the list, so it is clear what the page is
>>> about without having to read the ArGIS/Manifold document.
>> 
>> Yes please. I'd quite appreciate that.
> 
> OK, I'd say something like the following paragraph.  It is written kind 
> of assuming there was only one list, organised like the "supplement" 
> page is currently, using an * or something to indicate whether or not a 
> task was in the ArcGIS/Manifold document (I have a wiki account, so I 
> can add it, but I have some comments below about one vs two lists which 
> I'd like to hear your opinion on).
> 
> This section is intended to show how to perform basic GIS operations in QGIS in the most straightforward way.  It is modelled after “How do I do that in ArcGIS/Manifold?: illustrating classic GIS tasks”.  That document illustrated a selection of tasks which were thought to be representative of common usage in 2004, and was itself derived from a checklist of essential GIS functions that was included in 1988 in “A Process for Selecting Geographic Information Systems”.
> As well as everyday tasks for managing and presenting spatial data, this section includes common operations which are typically one step in a longer process of analysis.  More in-depth tutorials which detail all the steps to achieve a particular outcome are beyond the scope of this list and belong <FIXME:ADD-LINK here>.
> The use of GIS has changed over time, particularly in regard to data availability and the provision of services via the internet.  Feel free therefore to add appropriate tasks to the list.

I think that this can easily be used. I have some reasoning below.

>>> I suggest we:
>>> - add all the tasks from the ArcGIS/Manifold document to the list
>>> now, even though we haven't written them up for QGIS
>> 
>> I quite agree with this.
>> 
>>> - indicate whether each task was included in the ArcGIS/Manifold
>>> document.
>>> One way of doing this would be to use a table format and have a
>>> column
>>> for it.
>>> 
>>> - when writing up tasks, indicate "missing" functionality (see (2)
>>> above)
>> 
>> What's sitting in my head this morning/late last night is something
>> like:
>> 1. Under the HowTos heading a page that links directly to to little
>> descriptions of purely what's in the ArcGIS/Manifold document. This
>> would allow a rapid and direct comparison.
>> 
>> 2. Also under the HowTos heading a page that has links out to all
>> classic tasks (including the ones in the ArcGIS/Manifold document).
>> This then would be a place for Deleting columns from Tables. This
>> could be broken up into relatively obvious sections (as a default I'd
>> probably use those in the How do I document)
> 
> Are you sure it is a good idea to have two separate lists, as it is currently?  
> There is already at least one topic which has ended up with two different links 
> on the two pages ("Creating a polygon from line segments").
> 
> Two lists means that any time someone writes a task that is included in both 
> lists they might decide to give it a different title, and update the link in 
> the main list but not realise that they also need to update it in the 
> "supplement" list.  Even if they guess that the task also appears in the 
> "supplement" list, to update the link there they will need to look carefully 
> for it, because the two lists are arranged differently and some of the titles 
> are different.
> 
> Maintaining two separate lists seems to me like unnecessary work.
> What do you think?

I am not sure. I think it will work, and I don't really see a good alternative.

Here is the thought process. Some of this relates to things that Anitagraser has been pointing out to me along the way, and that sometimes I've been a little slow picking up on. (and yes, thanks for trying to keep me on the straight and narrow).

Firstly, when I'm moving between different software that does more or less the same thing terminology changes are really frustrating. So I'd really like to keep the "supplement" list as close as possible in names and structure to the ArcGIS/Manifold document. This means that people looking for things on that page are being shown something that is familiar. When you're doing new things, familiar is comforting and makes transitions seem easier.
(I still regard myself as new at QGIS. I think this familiarity concept is important, even if I'm not from an ArcGIS or Manifold background.)

Secondly, there are some terminology things that are problematic. For instance, the usage of database in the ArcGIS document makes sense to me, but not Anitagraser; and even I'll admit it's not the common usage any more. Another example is the "Importing tables, vectors and rasters" page. While technically that process is importing, at a user end it's been a long time since I thought of it anything other than opening.

So this leaves a problem. To preserve 1, the terminology remains. To consider 2 we loose familiarity.

The solution that Anitagraser and I thought sounded reasonable was to preserve 1 in the "supplement" page, so that people from ArcGIS and Manifold backgrounds had something that was immediately familiar, and only have equivalents of what's in the ArcGIS/Manifold document on that page.
That leaves the second list to have more familiar usages (e.g. the data/database problem) and additional things. Where both pages deal with one topic, they *should* link to the *same* page and that page should have the name from the second list.

It should only be a bit of hassle while I'm still setting things up. All the tasks in the "supplement" list should be referenced from both the second list, and the "supplement" pages. There are then also pages on the second list that aren't in the "supplement" list. Then once the set up is finished, it should be the case that if a common topic is updated on the larger second list, to the equivalent page in the "supplement" is also updated.

That is, we should only have to maintain the second list. And we have the supplement for ArcGIS/Manifold converts.


Seem reasonable?


I'll sort out the Creating a polygon from a line bit now. It shouldn't be like that.

-ramon.