[OSGeo-Standards] [OSGeo-Discuss] Live DVD and OGC standards

Mon Jul 8 15:28:12 PDT 2013

good point you make, Jeff - maybe we should see both as two sides of the same coin, actually.
-Peter

--
Dr. Peter Baumann- Professor of Computer Science, Jacobs University Bremen
  http://www.faculty.jacobs-university.de/pbaumann
  mail: p.baumann at jacobs-university.detel: +49-421-200-3178, fax: +49-421-200-493178
- Executive Director, rasdaman GmbH Bremen (HRB 26793)http://www.rasdaman.com,
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________________________________
From: Jeff Harrison [jharrison at thecarbonproject.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2013 12:25 AM
To: Baumann, Peter
Cc: Newcomb, Doug; TC Discuss; osgeo-discuss; Carl Reed; standards at lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards] Live DVD and OGC standards

Peter,

Yep, sometimes users don't want to bite off the whole piece.

Personally, I feel the future is a mix of open data formats (XML, CSV, JSON etc) and open data services...

Regards,
Jeff

Jeff Harrison
The Carbon Project
Twitter: @JeffHarrison

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 8, 2013, at 5:55 PM, "Baumann, Peter" <p.baumann at jacobs-university.de<mailto:p.baumann at jacobs-university.de>> wrote:

absolutely so! If you want to access data items as a whole piece, and the item fits through the pipe conveniently then I am fully on board. However, sometimes we want to get pieces that fit the pipe (and convenient for us to chew), and we want something to be done - my favorite example on remote sensing imagery is the vegetation index. Or even a histogram: my fav here is CSV, or JSON, or... but not to download a NetCDF file. So, as so often: it depends.

cheers,
Peter

--
Dr. Peter Baumann- Professor of Computer Science, Jacobs University Bremen
  http://www.faculty.jacobs-university.de/pbaumann
  mail: p.baumann at jacobs-university.detel<mailto:p.baumann at jacobs-university.detel>: +49-421-200-3178, fax: +49-421-200-493178
- Executive Director, rasdaman GmbH Bremen (HRB 26793)http://www.rasdaman.com,
  mail: baumann at rasdaman.com<mailto:baumann at rasdaman.com>
  tel: 0800-rasdaman, fax: 0800-rasdafax, mobile: +49-173-5837882
"Si forte in alienas manus oberraverit hec peregrina epistola incertis ventis dimissa, sed Deo commendata, precamur ut ei reddatur cui soli destinata, nec preripiat quisquam non sibi parata." (mail disclaimer, AD 1083)

________________________________
From: Newcomb, Doug [doug_newcomb at fws.gov<mailto:doug_newcomb at fws.gov>]
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2013 11:26 PM
To: Baumann, Peter
Cc: Stefan Keller; Carl Reed; osgeo-discuss; TC Discuss; standards at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:standards at lists.osgeo.org>
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards] Live DVD and OGC standards

Dr. Baumann,

Lighting my torch...;-)

On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 5:12 PM, Baumann, Peter <p.baumann at jacobs-university.de<mailto:p.baumann at jacobs-university.de>> wrote:

Finally, my personal 2 cents: I feel the future is with services, not formats will decide in future. Do I care, in my browser, whether I see PNG or JPEG or...GIF? http functionality, Ajax and the like is what I care about. Flames on... ;-)

I like using Services when that are open standard formats,  but services are ephemeral.  A local source in an open standard format is better for archival / reproduction of work products.

Doug

cheers,
Peter

--
Dr. Peter Baumann- Professor of Computer Science, Jacobs University Bremen
  http://www.faculty.jacobs-university.de/pbaumann
  mail: p.baumann at jacobs-university.detel<mailto:p.baumann at jacobs-university.detel>: +49-421-200-3178, fax: +49-421-200-493178
- Executive Director, rasdaman GmbH Bremen (HRB 26793)http://www.rasdaman.com,
  mail: baumann at rasdaman.com<mailto:baumann at rasdaman.com>
  tel: 0800-rasdaman, fax: 0800-rasdafax, mobile: +49-173-5837882
"Si forte in alienas manus oberraverit hec peregrina epistola incertis ventis dimissa, sed Deo commendata, precamur ut ei reddatur cui soli destinata, nec preripiat quisquam non sibi parata." (mail disclaimer, AD 1083)

________________________________________
From: discuss-bounces at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.osgeo.org> [discuss-bounces at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.osgeo.org>] on behalf of Stefan Keller [sfkeller at gmail.com<mailto:sfkeller at gmail.com>]
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2013 10:59 PM
To: Carl Reed
Cc: osgeo-discuss; TC Discuss; standards at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:standards at lists.osgeo.org>
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards]  Live DVD and OGC standards

Hi Carl

2013/7/8 Carl Reed <creed at opengeospatial.org<mailto:creed at opengeospatial.org>>:
> The idea that the OGC process would significantly change something like GeoRSS is untrue.

I would like to slightly disagree here and point to the ongoing
GeoPackage standardization.
Referring to the initial question, GeoPackage with SQLite/Spatialite
"format" would have a chance to become "the Shapefile of the future".
The OGC just recently had the chance to adopt this existing encoding -
but unfortunately voted against in favor of an own spec.
To be fair to OGC (which I respect) I'd have to say that such
political decisions happen to most standardization bodies.

Yours, Stefan

2013/7/8 Carl Reed <creed at opengeospatial.org<mailto:creed at opengeospatial.org>>:
> Allan -
>
> I respectfully disagree with your comment regarding the authors not wanting to bring GeoRSS into the OGC. I know that Raj, myself and other original authors would support bringing GeoRSS into the OGC as is.
>
> The idea that the OGC process would significantly change something like GeoRSS is untrue. A good recent example is Open GeoSMS. That candidate standard was developed externally and submitted into the OGC. The normative content was not changed at all other than making one tag consistent with some IETF RFCs (HELD, LoST, etc). We also separated the normative text from the informative examples (primer) which made the standard very short and easier to understand. Additional "eyes" on a document does not necessarily mean any normative change but does mean improvement to the document (grammar, wording, clarity, etc).
>
> Cheers
>
> Carl
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Arnulf Christl" <arnulf.christl at metaspatial.net<mailto:arnulf.christl at metaspatial.net>>
> To: standards at lists.osgeo.org<mailto:standards at lists.osgeo.org>, "TC Discuss" <tc-discuss at lists.opengeospatial.org<mailto:tc-discuss at lists.opengeospatial.org>>
> Sent: Monday, July 8, 2013 9:11:27 AM
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Standards] [OSGeo-Discuss] Live DVD and OGC standards
>
> On 08.07.2013 14:14, Rushforth, Peter wrote:
>> Hi Allan,
>>
>>> The counter-example is actually GeoTIFF, which was proposed
>>> as an OGC format a long, long time ago, by the original
>>> authors of the spec. At the time, it was rejected
>>> specifically because the TC felt that OGC should not be
>>> standardizing file specs, but rather should be standardizing
>>> interfaces.
>>
>> Ironic, because the strength of the Web is based on 'file' specs.  The
>> geo community needs to think less about interfaces and more about
>> how to communicate state through "files".
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Peter
>
> Peter,
> so true, I couldn't agree more. Why is it that there is a perception
> that the OGC should not work on data formats but only interfaces? Is
> this still the case? With GML and KML there are two strong existing data
> standards. GeoPackage is not exactly "just" a media format but ships
> with code - an ideal package so to say, and by any means not just an
> interface standard.
>
> GeoRSS and GeoJSON would not be hard to go forward with but for some
> reason it never happened.
>
> Cheers,
> Arnulf
>
> --
> Arnulf Christl (Executive Director)
> Open Source Geospatial Software, Data and Services
> http://www.metaspatial.net
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--
Doug Newcomb
USFWS
Raleigh, NC
919-856-4520 ext. 14 doug_newcomb at fws.gov<mailto:doug_newcomb at fws.gov>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The opinions I express are my own and are not representative of the official policy of the U.S.Fish and Wildlife Service or Dept. of the Interior.   Life is too short for undocumented, proprietary data formats.
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