[OSGeo Africa] Native reserves/locations as originally proclaimed in the Native Land Act of 1913 and later

Mon Apr 8 06:06:25 PDT 2013

Chris,

My understanding is that this book contains all the property 
decriptions, how much paid or not paid, reference to the proclomation, 
which areas are black white Indian etc.. etc.. - including how many 
people on that land etc..etc..

I remember being told of the figure here in KZN of the number of white 
farms expropriated to make way for black areas - it was certainly not 
numbers that you hear in the press and I was actually quite shocked.

I am told there are maps in this book as well. I am sure that its 
possible to work backwards and deduce what was 1913 land.

Regards

Peter

Peter Newmarch
Professional Land Surveyor
4Y GeoInformatics Pty Ltd
Tel : +27 31 5642856
Fax : +27 31 5643074
Mobile     : +27 82 5705859
eMail     : newmarch at land-surveyors.com

On 08/04/2013 14:43, Chris wrote:
>      Peter ,
>
>      Perhaps the newer legislation ( maps , boundaries etc ) superceded the
>      older stuff ?
>      I am no legal expert but for any legislation  with a spatial component
>      one would think that the spatial ( cadastral ) specification MUST be
>      quantifiable ( measureable ) -- otherwise how would you manage / govern
>      it ?
>
>      There appears to be a HUGE lacuna here -- all the actually measureable
>      and verifiable aspects to the "seperate-devekopment"  programs / projects
>      appears to be missing or not very well recorded ? Not only so-called
>      black communal land was in question but also many white owned farms that
>      were expropriated.
>
>      There must be a massive box of files gathering dust somewhere ( perhaps
>      they have all already gone "missing"  ? )
>
>      I am shocked that no provision has been made for these incredibly
>      hiostorically valueable documents to be scanned / digitised. ( There is
>      no digital copy of the Tomlinson report -- or probably the Fagan and
>      Sauer reports -- and many others. ) Some American University of
>      institution is probabaly busy with it as I write -- they seem to care
>      more about our heritage that we do !
>
>
>      CM
>
>
> On 8 Apr 2013 at 14:04, Peter Newmarch wrote:
>
>> I believe that this is possible.
>>
>> I was once told about a certain book called the Government "Blue" or "Red"
>> book which was the documentation about all the apartheid era land
>> transactions - how many whites, blacks, Indians moved / relocated / forced
>> etc.. etc.. - property descriptions, notice numbers etc.. etc... - now,
>> while of a different era 1950's 1960's it will have the areas prior to
>> that 1913 - it will either expand the 1913 areas or abolish them. - so it
>> would be possible to work backwards from this book.
>>
>> The problem is, my source was aware of only 3 such books being in
>> existence - two have already been lost apparently. I have not had the time
>> to track down the last copy. But I will give this information to Aslam who
>> may have better contacts than me in getting a copy of it.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Peter
>>
>>
>> Peter Newmarch
>> Professional Land Surveyor
>> 4Y GeoInformatics Pty Ltd
>> Tel : +27 31 5642856
>> Fax : +27 31 5643074
>> Mobile     : +27 82 5705859
>> eMail     : newmarch at land-surveyors.com
>>
>> On 08/04/2013 13:24, Chris wrote:
>>>       Hi Aslam ,
>>>
>>>       Have you had a look at the the Report of the Tomlinson Commission ?
>>>       ( all the many volumes and maps )
>>>
>>>       I am very sure that there must have been a spatial component to the
>>>       1913 Act -- I would also think that this would have been the
>>>       responsibility of the SG ?  ( Definitely some Gov department )
>>>
>>>       There is some info for Natal but this would not be the whole
>>>       country.
>>>
>>>       "The Native Reserves in Natal ( Natal Regional Survey Vol V11 )
>>>       Edgar H Brookes and N Hurwitz University of Natal
>>>
>>>       Have you had a look at "Disputed Land"   ( the book )
>>>
>>>       Did you attend the land conference at UCT ?
>>>
>>>       http://www.landdivided2013.org.za
>>>
>>>       Lots of papers presented but I do not see anythung that would
>>>       excite a land surveyor or a GIS practioner. It would appear that
>>>       historians / social scientists know nothing about spatial and
>>>       surveyors know nothing about history ?
>>>
>>>       The whole thing looks just like a talk shop -- something academics
>>>       are famous for. How can you analyze something if you have not
>>>       quantified it ?
>>>
>>>       Perhaps mail Aninka Claassens
>>>       or
>>>
>>>       Prof Johann Kirsten at Pretoria University Ag Econ department  -
>>>       Johann is a grandson of Prof Tomlinson.
>>>
>>>       WHERE are the Spatial experts -- Historical Geographers ?
>>>
>>>       Still -- when I see the Ford Foundation and Konrad Adenauer
>>>       together I am not expecting anything more than a bound report and
>>>       conclusions that favour certain political themes !
>>>
>>>       Please let me know if you do manage to track down the full spatial
>>>       complement to the 1913 Land Act. Perhaps ask Linda ........
>>>
>>>
>>>       CM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8 Apr 2013 at 12:06, Aslam Parker wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi All
>>>> I know this is a long shot, but is there anyone who has data on the
>>>> location of Native Reserves as proclaimed in the 1913 Land Act and
>>>> subsequent amendment. The TVBC states is a relatively recent artifact
>>>> of the Apartheid Government land engineering project, for which I have
>>>> information. I also have maps showing the location of Native Reserves
>>>> in the 1960's. I am looking for maps older than this.
>>>    
>>>> Any leads will be appreciated.
>>>    
>>>> Kind regards
>>>    
>>>> Aslam Parker | Director: Geo-spatial Information and Professional
>>>> Support |Chief Directorate: National Geo-spatial Information
>>>> www.ngi.gov.za| Cape Town| Tel +27 21 658 4302| Fax +27 86 211 7919|
>>>> Mobile 082 331 8501| aparker at ruraldevelopment.gov.za
>>>    
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Africa mailing list
>>> Africa at lists.osgeo.org
>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/africa
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
>

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