[OSGeo-Discuss] Sharing sad news from the web...

Randal Hale rjhale at northrivergeographic.com
Fri Oct 28 07:47:41 PDT 2016

Ha - I can't even spell Briliant.

For instance - the school I work with has built a 2 week curriculum 
around open street map. The teacher (a former college associate from 
many years ago) knows the basics so the kids get a taste. The problem is 
I don't like the curriculum because they need to interface with the OSM 
community - and I can't interface with the OSM community without 
cursing. So one week 3 years ago I burned a lot of time trying to teach. 
I can't teach kids. Plus a week from work (while only an hour a day - I 
work for me) was a bit much.

Kids know (I can only speak to the US) "GIS" - they have smart phones. 
They know location ("How do I get to a Coffee Shop") and the phone 
routes them there. So the lessons don't have to start at "this is a 
computer" which in some cases I have to do while teaching QGIS to adults.

The lessons just have to be simple. Easy. Update-able. QGIS is at a 1 
year LTR. So once a year we update the materials. Maybe GVSig?

Three giant buttons on the FOSS4G4Teachers website: Help, Download, More 

What ESRI is missing with this rollout is it's internet based. The 
school I work with - internet is sporadic at best (I live in a city 
where we have the ability to have 1 Gigabit Fiber to the house but 
schools are left out). So online lessons will not work. Give them a 
bootable disk with Lessons and Community. Someone go bother Mapbox/Carto 
for some "internet" based something - see if they want to help carry it 
farther. Maybe we have USB Sticks for order? Something easy and small.

In 1 year you start to change the noise.

Don't get me wrong - GIS is my focus. I still have to use ESRI Software. 
It's good software. I come here for Community. We have that nailed down 
- it's a time issue. Maybe a language issue also (english, spanish, 
and......) . We've got everything else.

On 10/28/2016 10:16 AM, Hogan, Patrick (ARC-PX) wrote:
> +++++++++1
> Randy, you are a brilliant voice of reason.
> I’m sure the cat wants you to be free to speak.
> Glad it didn’t get your tongue. ;-)
> *From:*Discuss [mailto:discuss-bounces at lists.osgeo.org] *On Behalf Of 
> *Randal Hale
> *Sent:* Friday, October 28, 2016 6:55 AM
> *To:* discuss at lists.osgeo.org
> *Subject:* Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Sharing sad news from the web...
> If I can just chime in (I told my cat I wasn't).
> The kicker in this is ESRI is deeply entrenched everywhere. They've 
> entire groups of people just focused on "giving to schools". I was at 
> the helm of rolling out a full ESRI rollout to a school in 2012. We 
> had a 50 seat lab setup. I ended up moving them over to FOSS4G 2 years 
> ago - and I need to go back and update their setup (they don't know 
> how). The school is Title 1 (which means the school is very poor). The 
> computers are better than what they normally get - BUT - they will be 
> using them longer than what they need to. They will be unable to run 
> the next version of ESRI Software. The computers can still run FOSS4G 
> software.
> The teachers here in the US (and I have no doubt this is the case 
> everywhere) are stretched thin. That's what makes ESRI so nice. They 
> show up and go "here is a curriculum (of sorts) and here is 'free' 
> software". It's a short term win. They have people targeted to do just 
> that.
> So what would Randy do (and I've thought about this more than I care 
> to mention) to introduce FOSS4G into the schools:
> A bootable disk with FOSS4G software (I am partial to QGIS - other 
> things exist) and not everything like the OSGEO Disk. A few select 
> pieces of software with a purpose:
>   * 10 lessons of 1 hour apiece to work through that are student
>     oriented (maybe pick an age range - 12-16)
>       o Start globally and work down to locally. Maybe we have
>         different local datasets.
>   * An explanation for the teachers. They don't understand like we do
>     - they need us there for hand holding and encouragement. They can
>     manage kids - We need to help manage the lessons. I'm not a
>     teacher. I can teach adults - but not kids - it's a whole
>     different  game.
>   * A spot where teachers can get the lessons (NOT GITHUB) and the
>     disk (maybe we combine all things into a bootable USB stick).
>   * Help - a place where they can get help (NOT GITHUB). My town has
>     30+ schools. If more than 1 does this I can't be everywhere. ESRI
>     put out a call for Geomentors. We put out a call.
>   * We have COMMUNITY - I don't believe ESRI currently does. They have
>     an advertising budget. 20 years ago they had community. We have
>     momentum now. Community is greater than an Advertising budget.
>   * Advertise it. Ask for help from the teachers.
>   * Update it.
> I know I'm asking for a lot - it's time intensive - but I think it's 
> 100% doable. I go to speak at 2 colleges on GIS Day on nothing but 
> We've got all the pieces to make this work except time. I'll carve out 
> some time if this gets going.
> I wished the cat had stopped me. Now I'm in it.
> On 10/28/2016 09:16 AM, Jeff McKenna wrote:
>     As if someone is reading this ha, a tweet just came across my
>     desk: https://twitter.com/GIS4Teachers/status/791981572991746048
>     So, we need to also get into that huge K-12 market, plant the open
>     seed early :)  A challenge indeed.
>     Think on this over the weekend,
>     -jeff
>     On 2016-10-27 12:36 PM, SERGIO ACOSTAYLARA wrote:
>     Sadly, only ESRI seems to exist for some in the USA...Imagine the
>     consequences of
>     this:
>     http://www.pobonline.com/articles/100610-gathering-up-geospatial-pros-to-meet-massive-market-growth
>     Sergio Acosta y Lara
>     Departamento de Geomática
>     Dirección Nacional de Topografía
>     Ministerio de Transporte y Obras Públicas
>     (598)29157933 ints. 20329/20330
>     http://geoportal.mtop.gub.uy/
>     _______________________________________________
>     Discuss mailing list
>     Discuss at lists.osgeo.org <mailto:Discuss at lists.osgeo.org>
>     http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> -- 
> -----------------
> Randal Hale
> North River Geographic Systems, Inc
> http://www.northrivergeographic.com
> 423.653.3611rjhale at northrivergeographic.com <mailto:rjhale at northrivergeographic.com>
> twitter:rjhale

Randal Hale
North River Geographic Systems, Inc
423.653.3611 rjhale at northrivergeographic.com

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