[Incubator] Info on the Old OSGeo Labs

Jody Garnett jody.garnett at gmail.com
Tue Mar 8 07:13:35 PST 2016

We are setting something up different that is not OSGeo labs. We are
validating - that these projects are open source and participatory.

The result is hopefully a larger OSGeo community.

This direction comes out of a board discussion around being inclusive and
innovative. It could be the OSGeo Technology idea won't fly ...

Our OSGeo incubation process is set up for stability and safety. While I
respect this it is holding us back from including different categories of

I think the larger issue for the board to wrestle with is that the
foundation does not provide enough value to projects. While they are
willing to step up assistance (say incubation sprint or external code
review) we on the incubation list need to look at our priorities on who we
can extend this assistance to.

I would still like to see projects like pgRouting try their hand at
incubation. I think it is a shame incubation. and the foundation, is
considered hard.

In fact open source is hard, and we are here to help.

On Tue, Mar 8, 2016 at 2:35 AM Cameron Shorter <cameron.shorter at gmail.com>

> Hey Jody,
> I'm actually agreeing with all you are suggesting doing with the rebranded
> "OSGeo Labs", except the name "OSGeo Technology". This name misrepresents
> the "Self Serve", non-validated concept of "OSGeo Labs". The name implies
> "built out of OSGeo Projects".  This is a dis-service to people who come to
> our site for the first time, a dis-service to "OSGeo Projects" who now
> become associated with immature projects.
> Pick a more accurate name than "OSGeo Technology" and I'd back the rest of
> what you are suggesting.
> Warm regards, Cameron
> On 7/03/2016 9:55 am, Jody Garnett wrote:
> This is going to be a tough one Cameron ... our brand currently has a
> reputation for turning projects away ... not quality.
> The long story short is how to respond to the direction to be inclusive.
> We have two strong characters on this mailing list with an axe to grind
> making it difficult for projects to be part of OSGeo. I am very keen on
> projects *being* open source, and you are very keen on making projects safe
> for users to adopt (project viability, quality, open standards).
> I am proposing repurposing "OSGeo Labs" (which did not promise anything as
> a brand and got adopted by GeoForAll) as "OSGeo Technology" to focus on the
> open source angle; in order to preserve "OSGeo Projects" (and incubation)
> to focus on the second.
> We have a tension here between being inclusive (read easy) and transparent
> (which takes effort).
> How would you like to add "transparency" to this mix? We could provide a
> table with website, download, documentation, test results - not sure if
> that would help with transparency?
> I know we keep coming back to a rating system on this mailing list - I
> recognize your work in this area for OSGeo Live with the introduction of
> black duck metrics. I imagine you would also be happy to phrase things as
> positive "badges" (for projects that have documentation, or quality
> assurance, or standards testing).  For quality, documentation and so forth
> I think we are stuck leading by example (and perhaps working with the OGC
> on standards compliance).
> On 3 March 2016 at 23:57, Cameron Shorter <cameron.shorter at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> Hi Jody,
>> I agree with your suggestion that "Old OSGeo Labs" need not have an aim
>> of entering OSGeo incubation.
>> However, I object to any project becoming associated with OSGeo without
>> it being obvious about the level of quality control the project has gone
>> through.
>> As suggested below, I could knock together 100 lines of uncommented,
>> non-working code, give it an open source license, and then add a "OSGeo
>> Technology" logo to the home page. And most average punters wouldn't know
>> the difference between term "OSGeo Project" and "OSGeo Technology". This
>> would result in diminishing the current association between OSGeo
>> applications and quality, which would be a bad thing.
>> I feel "OSGeo Labs", "OSGeo Community Builder Projects", or shortened to
>> "OSGeo Builder Projects" are less likely to be confused with "OSGeo
>> Incubated" projects.
>> Warm regards, Cameron
>> On 4/03/2016 2:13 am, Stephen Woodbridge wrote:
>>> +1, I think these changes make a lot of sense and as part of an OSGeo
>>> Technology project this feels very inclusive.
>>> -Steve W
>>> On 3/3/2016 9:46 AM, Jody Garnett wrote:
>>>> I would like to change the tone of the page a bit, since it "assumes"
>>>> incubation ..
>>>>     /OSGeo Labs is an umbrella for open source geospatial software
>>>>     projects that would like to become OSGeo projects in the future, but
>>>>     that aren't ready for incubation quite yet. It is appropriate to
>>>>     submit your new or experimental project as an OSGeo labs project./
>>>>     /
>>>>     /
>>>>     /The volunteers that work as part of OSGeo Labs have the goal of
>>>>     helping OSGeo Labs Projects qualify for incubation. To reach this
>>>>     goal, OSGeo Labs volunteers help OSGeo Labs Projects with the
>>>>     following tasks:
>>>>     /
>>>> Would become:
>>>>     /Welcome to OSGeo Technology. The projects listed here are part of
>>>>     the Open Source Geospatial Foundation and range from new
>>>>     experimental projects to established pillars of our open source
>>>>     ecosystem./
>>>>     /
>>>>     /
>>>>     /All projects here meet our goals as an organization - they are open
>>>>     source (no really we checked) and are inclusive and welcoming to new
>>>>     contributors./
>>>>     /
>>>>     /
>>>>     /Projects that go on to establish excellence in community building,
>>>>     documentation, and governance can enter our "incubation" program. /
>>>> I would also lose the "status" conditions seed/seedling/sapling/adult
>>>> and keep OSGeo Technology focused on the basics (open source &
>>>> inclusive). The status becomes having the "OSGeo Technology" badge nice
>>>> and simple.
>>>> Thinking this through a bit more we have one clear reason for projects
>>>> to go through with incubation - being recognized by the board and having
>>>> an OSGeo Officer listed directly for the project, while OSGeo Technology
>>>> projects "share" an officer (as part of "incubation committee").
>>>> --
>>>> Jody Garnett
>>>> On 11 February 2016 at 11:04, Landon Blake <
>>>> sunburned.surveyor at gmail.com
>>>> <mailto:sunburned.surveyor at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>     There is some good information on what we were trying to achieve
>>>>     with the old OSGeo Labs on the wiki:
>>>>     https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Labs
>>>>     I think most of that information on the wiki still applies. This
>>>>     includes the purpose of labs, how projects get started in labs, what
>>>>     labs is trying to accomplish, and the criteria to determine if your
>>>>     project is a good fit for labs.
>>>>     Does anyone have major heartburn with what is laid out on that wiki
>>>>     page? (I'll rename the wiki page as soon as we get a new name for
>>>> labs.)
>>>>     Landon
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>> --
>> Cameron Shorter,
>> Software and Data Solutions Manager
>> LISAsoft
>> Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
>> 26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009
>> P +61 2 9009 5000 <%2B61%202%209009%205000>,  W www.lisasoft.com,  F +61
>> 2 9009 5099 <%2B61%202%209009%205099>
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> --
> Cameron Shorter,
> Software and Data Solutions Manager
> LISAsoft
> Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
> 26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009
> P +61 2 9009 5000,  W www.lisasoft.com,  F +61 2 9009 5099
> --
Jody Garnett
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